From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Jan 2 17:27:53 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:14 2005 Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question Message-ID: Does anybody have any good tips for deburring holes in tight places? I'm thinking of locations such as the insides of control-surface ribs near the tip, where there's no room to get a normal deburring tool in. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From wjoke at shaw.ca Wed Jan 2 18:14:57 2002 From: wjoke at shaw.ca (Jim Oke) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:14 2005 Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question References: Message-ID: <00a201c193fc$88dcd4e0$6401a8c0@cd708596a> Hi Tedd, All I did was use a very thin flat file to get the worst of the chips from drilling the hole off. Then some scotchbrite to generally smooth things over. Not a true "countersunk" deburr, but more of a "best available" solution. Try Cdn Tire or Princess Auto for a "needle" file set. A few dollars for a set of 6 or 8 small files. Handy for doing odd corners and angles throughout the project. One tip, use fluting pliers or similar to open up the rib flange to get your dimpling set or whatever in place, dimple to taste, then re-bend the flange to 90 deg. Also if the skin holes are not drilled as yet, try and offset the top & bottom surface holes towards the aft end of the rib by 3/16 - 1/4 in or so. This will be a help when it comes time to try and rivet in this area. A Princess Auto "splitting wedge", normally used for chopping up logs for your fireplace, is a reasonable substitute for a normal bucking bar in this area too. The pop rivet route is another way to go. Jim Oke CYWG ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" <> To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2002 7:27 PM Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question > Does anybody have any good tips for deburring holes in tight places? I'm > thinking of locations such as the insides of control-surface ribs near the tip, > where there's no room to get a normal deburring tool in. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Jan 2 18:32:39 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:14 2005 Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question Message-ID: Jim: Exellent suggestions, thanks! I wish I'd heard of that splitting wedge idea a while ago. I spent hours grinding a tapered bucking bar from raw stock, and I already have a splitting wedge in my garage! Tedd From mdeg at shaw.ca Wed Jan 2 19:39:45 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:14 2005 Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question References: Message-ID: <006e01c19408$8e262bc0$05e64218@ss.shawcable.net> Hi Ted.......I used a .025 feeler guage to debur alot of holes when nothing else would work......It is stiff enough and the edge is sharp enough to cut the bur off the edge of the hole (which is all you really have to do anyway). A piece of emery cloth or scotchbrite will finish the job.... Marc DeGirolamo C-FRVE ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2002 7:27 PM Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question > Does anybody have any good tips for deburring holes in tight places? I'm > thinking of locations such as the insides of control-surface ribs near the tip, > where there's no room to get a normal deburring tool in. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Jan 4 09:47:34 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:14 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In Message-ID: The Langley Aero Club (LAC) is planning an RV fly-in this summer, at Langley airport (CYNJ). I'd like to find out what sorts of things Wing members would like to see at the fly-in. LAC has several things already in mind: o RV training with Mike Seager o a "people's choice" award for the best RV o seminars or presentations on RV building and flying o food of some kind Do these ideas appeal to you? What are your preferences? What other events or activities would you like to see? If you're outside the Fraser Valley area, what sorts of things would motivate you to come to the Langley fly-in? If there are seminars or presentations, what topics would you like to see covered? You can write me directly at the address below, or reply to this list, with your ideas. Thanks, Tedd --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From reagleston at ibigroup.com Fri Jan 4 10:56:22 2002 From: reagleston at ibigroup.com (Ron Eagleston) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:14 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ted, As I am hoping to have my 8A completed within the next 10 months training with Mike Seager would be a great option. Ron Ron Eagleston IBI Group reagleston@ibigroup.com tel. (604) 683-8797 fax. (604) 683-0492 NOTE: This e-mail message and attachments may contain privileged and confidential information. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and delete this e-mail message. > From: Tedd McHenry > Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org > Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2002 09:47:34 -0800 (PST) > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In > > > The Langley Aero Club (LAC) is planning an RV fly-in this summer, at Langley > airport (CYNJ). I'd like to find out what sorts of things Wing members would > like to see at the fly-in. LAC has several things already in mind: > > o RV training with Mike Seager o a "people's choice" award for the best RV o > seminars or presentations on RV building and flying o food of some kind > > Do these ideas appeal to you? What are your preferences? What other events > or > activities would you like to see? If you're outside the Fraser Valley area, > what sorts of things would motivate you to come to the Langley fly-in? If > there are seminars or presentations, what topics would you like to see > covered? > > You can write me directly at the address below, or reply to this list, with > your ideas. > > Thanks, > > Tedd > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From fvalarm at rapidnet.net Fri Jan 4 11:50:25 2002 From: fvalarm at rapidnet.net (B. Tomm) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:14 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In References: Message-ID: <001701c19559$0ef8d120$aa8d35d1@cheryls> Tedd I'm very interested in attending (if not assisting) keep me informed. Bevan Abbotsford starting wings RV7A From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Jan 4 12:25:53 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:14 2005 Subject: [Wing] Email Address Help Message-ID: I have incorrect email addresses for the following Wing members. If you have the correct address for any of them, please send it to me so I can revise the membership list. Jensen, David Kelowna , BC drjensen@uniserve.com Sager, Jim Chilliwack, BC jsager@uniserve.com Mead, Jim Kamloops, BC Jim_Mead@bc.sympatico.ca Demchuk, Clarence Regina, SK ced912@hotmail.com Cox, Ken Sardis, BC ken_maxine_cox@hotmail.com Strike, TK. Sanford, NC www.eliteagency242@bellsouth.net Loewen, Burton Steinbach, MB stefurn@login.mb.sympatico.ca Gervais, Paul Olds, AB paul.gervais@gov.ab.ca Hurlbut, Steve Lazo, BC shurlbut@island.net Woodard, Don Spokane, WA aerorivit@netscape.net Thanks, Tedd --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From rdkennett at shaw.ca Sat Jan 5 22:40:42 2002 From: rdkennett at shaw.ca (Della & Robert Kennett) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In References: Message-ID: <000901c1967d$1087d3e0$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Tedd: This sounds like a great idea. Do you know yet when it will happen? With some luck, I might even be able to fly my 6A down to it. I should have the first flight by early summer, or perhaps sooner depending how the fibreglass work goes... If you have some seminars, one that my wife would be interested in is "what to take for overnight camping in an RV?". We used to enjoy going over to Texada or Tofino in the 172 and hope to do similar trips in the RV. Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: January 4, 2002 9:47 AM Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In > The Langley Aero Club (LAC) is planning an RV fly-in this summer, at Langley > airport (CYNJ). I'd like to find out what sorts of things Wing members would > like to see at the fly-in. LAC has several things already in mind: > > o RV training with Mike Seager o a "people's choice" award for the best RV o > seminars or presentations on RV building and flying o food of some kind > > Do these ideas appeal to you? What are your preferences? What other events or > activities would you like to see? If you're outside the Fraser Valley area, > what sorts of things would motivate you to come to the Langley fly-in? If > there are seminars or presentations, what topics would you like to see covered? > > You can write me directly at the address below, or reply to this list, with > your ideas. > > Thanks, > > Tedd > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Jan 9 22:30:44 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Operating Instructions and Checklists Message-ID: I've just made some long-overdue additions to the Wing web site, under the section "RV Operating Instructions and Checklists." We now have: RV-6A Pilot's Operating Handbook -------------------------------- by Scott Gesele formats: HTML; MS Word (4.6 MB); PDF (3.8 MB) RV-4 Pilot's Operating Handbook ------------------------------- (original author unknown) formats: HTML; MS Word (5.8 MB); PDF (2.7 MB) RV Flight Test Log Cards ------------------------ by Randy Pflanzer and Clay Smith formats: HTML; MS Word Roger Hopkinson's Pilot Operating Handbook ------------------------------------------ (link to another site) Homer Rogers's Annual Inspection Procedure ------------------------------------------ by Homer Rogers formats: HTML; MS Word (37 KB); PDF (82 KB) --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From rdkennett at shaw.ca Sat Jan 12 09:10:53 2002 From: rdkennett at shaw.ca (Della & Robert Kennett) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Microballoons Message-ID: <001801c19b8c$17fbf700$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> I have a couple of small dents that I would like to fill. Early in my project, the inspector said that if I had some inperfections (I didn't have any at that time....) , they could be filled with microballoons. Is this good advice? What sort of preparation would be needed? Should the surface be primed first or would scuffing/etching be sufficient? The other product I have considered is Superfil, but I already have some epoxy resin and microballoons for the fibreglass work. Thanks Rob Kennett, Westbank BC RV6A (wiring and other loose ends) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020112/d477ffa8/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Jan 12 17:04:45 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] 2002 Schedule of Events Message-ID: Thanks to Ken Hoshowski, we now have a schedule of fly-ins and other aviation events for BC on the Wing web site. You can see it at http://www.vansairforce.org/events/fly-in-out_2002.html If you'd like to add an event to this schedule, for western Canada or nearby states, please send the information to me (tedd@vansairforce.org). --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From mdeg at shaw.ca Sat Jan 12 19:07:13 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Microballoons References: <001801c19b8c$17fbf700$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <004201c19bdf$66a3aee0$05e64218@ss.shawcable.net> If the dent is in the aluminum I would just use a automotive type of filler such as bondo or any other lightweight filler......clean and scuff aluminum first and apply.....sand smoth with a block sander, feathering all edges. Epoxy with microballoons is OK too, but will want to slump as epoxy takes longer to set up than polyester resins......mix to the consistency of dry peanut butter and apply. Marc RV-4....flying ----- Original Message ----- From: Della & Robert Kennett To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 11:10 AM Subject: [Wing] Microballoons I have a couple of small dents that I would like to fill. Early in my project, the inspector said that if I had some inperfections (I didn't have any at that time....) , they could be filled with microballoons. Is this good advice? What sort of preparation would be needed? Should the surface be primed first or would scuffing/etching be sufficient? The other product I have considered is Superfil, but I already have some epoxy resin and microballoons for the fibreglass work. Thanks Rob Kennett, Westbank BC RV6A (wiring and other loose ends) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020112/3950d3b0/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Jan 15 15:00:59 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Help With Your C of A Application Message-ID: Thanks to Terry Elgood, MD-RA Regional Chief Inspector for BC, we now have a new feature on the Wing web site. It's an article Terry wrote that is intented to help you work your way through the calculations on Form 24-0079. If you're at that stage in your project, give it a try and let me know if it helps. Also, please pass on any errors you find, or suggestions you have to improve it. Terry wrote up the calculations, and I've checked it for typos, but there's always the possibility of something slipping through. Tedd --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From acornyn at telusplanet.net Tue Jan 15 18:32:49 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Brag References: Message-ID: <000701c19e36$17bd5070$231db8a1@USER> My nineteen year ol daughter soloed today! I'm the proud Dad. I think that I am more excited than she is.. If any one wants to abuse her, her email is kran@mailcity.com Al RV-6 flying From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 6:04 PM Subject: [Wing] 2002 Schedule of Events > Thanks to Ken Hoshowski, we now have a schedule of fly-ins and other aviation > events for BC on the Wing web site. You can see it at > > http://www.vansairforce.org/events/fly-in-out_2002.html > > If you'd like to add an event to this schedule, for western Canada or nearby > states, please send the information to me (tedd@vansairforce.org). > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Wed Jan 16 06:07:54 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Brag References: <000701c19e36$17bd5070$231db8a1@USER> Message-ID: <000b01c19e97$31d3d0e0$7a1ab8a1@dgmurray> Al - You will have to start wearing T-shirts so you won't pop your buttons ! What an awesome accomplishment for her. Did she do it in the RV? If so then you might HAVE to build another bird just so you will hve something to flt:-)) Soon you Thursday, Doug. ----- Original Message ----- From: Al Cornyn To: Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 7:32 PM Subject: [Wing] Brag > My nineteen year ol daughter soloed today! I'm the proud Dad. I think that > I am more excited than she is.. If any one wants to abuse her, her email is > kran@mailcity.com Al RV-6 flying > From: "Tedd McHenry" > To: "Western Canada Wing List" > Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 6:04 PM > Subject: [Wing] 2002 Schedule of Events > > > > Thanks to Ken Hoshowski, we now have a schedule of fly-ins and other > aviation > > events for BC on the Wing web site. You can see it at > > > > http://www.vansairforce.org/events/fly-in-out_2002.html > > > > If you'd like to add an event to this schedule, for western Canada or > nearby > > states, please send the information to me (tedd@vansairforce.org). > > > > --- > > > > Tedd McHenry > > Van's Air Force > > Western Canada Wing > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From acwrench at yahoo.ca Thu Jan 24 08:50:49 2002 From: acwrench at yahoo.ca (pat morency) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: wing thing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020124165049.65866.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> Has anyone recently completed or in the process of completing the wings on an RV-6. I have some questions regarding the flap brace and when it is installed. Also does the stub rib have to be put in with 9 rivets ( 5 from the aileron bracket and 4 flush on the rear spar Thanks for the feed back. Pat Morency --- Tedd McHenry wrote: > Pat: > > I can't think of anyone currently working on the > wings, off the top of my head. > I'm just about to start the wings. But there are > lots of people on the list > who have completed -6 wings. You might try sending > out a question to the list. > Just send an email to wing@vansairforce.org. Your > questions are bound to spark > an interesting discussion. > > What sort of problems have you run into? Whatever > they are, I'm sure I'll be > facing them soon, too. > > Tedd > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > On Tue, 22 Jan 2002, pat morency wrote: > > > Tedd, > > Do you know of anyone in your mailing list who is > now > > working on their wing set of an RV6. I seem to be > > running into a wall in a few areas. > > Thanks, > > Pat Morency/Calgary > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! > http://website.yahoo.ca > > > ______________________________________________________________________ Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca From wjoke at shaw.ca Thu Jan 24 12:07:31 2002 From: wjoke at shaw.ca (Jim Oke) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: wing thing References: <20020124165049.65866.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001e01c1a512$c223b940$6401a8c0@cd708596a> Hi Pat (and Tedd); I finished my wings about six months ago (well, I'm at the 99% stage and holding) so perhaps I can comment. The flap brace can be left fairly late in the game but some preparation early on will help. Try and predict where flap brace rivets in the aft spar will fall and then leave the rib-to-rear spar rivets at these locations undrilled until fitting the flap brace. You want to drill through the flap brace, the rear spar, and a wing rib (aft flange) together to avoid extra holes that are close together. I riveted the bottom skins on, then fitted and riveted the flap brace and then riveted the top skin on (after my DABA inspection.) The plans are not that descriptive at the root end of the spar brace - where it over laps the extra 1/8" doubler for the 5/16 spar bolt location. Check the photos in the manual for an idea of how the cut out in this area goes. Again, avoid drilling the doubler to aft spar holes in the flap brace area too early. These should be drilled as one if at all possible. There is a tendency to let the let the brace get "pushed down" in this area which will cause a bend in the flap hinge line - use a straight edge on the lower surface to avoid. This may mean that the top edge of the brace will require some notches to be filed in it to clear the top row of rivets in the doubler. While on the subject of the aft spar, also look ahead to the aileron gap seal installation. Rib-to-spar hole drilling is not a problem but the lower rivets should be 426s vice 470s to have a smooth surface for the bottom of the gap seal to rest on. The stub rib needs some care in drilling the holes. I would suggest a few 3/32 flush rivets spaced in between the "final" 1/8 rivets to hold things in place. (The plans show this for the outer bracket already). If you are able to get along with clamps only in this area until drilling the inner aileron bracket, that would be even better. Assuming you have the PP skins, then the skins will determine the rib's location and the rib-to-spar rivets are less of a factor. The "final" five 1/8 bracket-to-spar rivets will be ample strength to hold the stub rib in place - no need for the "standard" four rivets the other ribs require as well. BTW, I drilled the outer bracket first and then used my completed ailerons (with the hinge fittings installed on the brackets with the spacers and other hardware) to set the location of the inner bracket. I don't think I even bothered measuring anything spanwise. Vertical location does count though so pay some attention to this to preserve the airfoil shape. Try and get a look at a flying RV-6 to get a feel for the size and shape of aileron pushrod hole in the spar. The plans are quite far off of this - a kidney shaped hole angling up and in to almost the top spar flange is actually needed vice a square hole lower down per dwg 21. Cut early and large and you will save a lot of tedious labour later on. Make it good and big - that's why the big .063 doubter is there. Glad to help with more questions, as you have them. Jim Oke Wpg RV-3 (flies sometimes) RV-6A (wiring & cowl stuff) ----- Original Message ----- From: "pat morency" To: "Tedd McHenry" Cc: Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2002 10:50 AM Subject: [Wing] Re: wing thing > Has anyone recently completed or in the process of > completing the wings on an RV-6. I have some questions > regarding the flap brace and when it is installed. > Also does the stub rib have to be put in with 9 rivets > ( 5 from the aileron bracket and 4 flush on the rear > spar > Thanks for the feed back. > Pat Morency > --- Tedd McHenry wrote: > > Pat: > > > > I can't think of anyone currently working on the > > wings, off the top of my head. > > I'm just about to start the wings. But there are > > lots of people on the list > > who have completed -6 wings. You might try sending > > out a question to the list. > > Just send an email to wing@vansairforce.org. Your > > questions are bound to spark > > an interesting discussion. > > > > What sort of problems have you run into? Whatever > > they are, I'm sure I'll be > > facing them soon, too. > > > > Tedd > > > > --- > > > > Tedd McHenry > > Van's Air Force > > Western Canada Wing > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > On Tue, 22 Jan 2002, pat morency wrote: > > > > > Tedd, > > > Do you know of anyone in your mailing list who is > > now > > > working on their wing set of an RV6. I seem to be > > > running into a wall in a few areas. > > > Thanks, > > > Pat Morency/Calgary > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! > > http://website.yahoo.ca > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Feb 1 14:04:16 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] ANR Headset Comparison Message-ID: Thanks to Rob Prior, we have a new article on the Wing web site comparing four popular models of ANR headsets: the David Clark 10-13XL, Flightcom Denali, Lightspeed 20XL, and Lightspeed QFR Cross Country. Rob and his cohorts performed detailed labratory and in-flight tests of the headsets. It's a good read, and very valuable information if you're in the market for headsets. http://www.vansairforce.org/misc/headsets/ --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From wordeng at telus.net Sat Feb 2 16:07:01 2002 From: wordeng at telus.net (George Worden) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP Message-ID: After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear but the starter is toast. Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, the starter was not loose on its mounts. George Worden From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Feb 2 15:45:08 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP In-Reply-To: Message-ID: George: > It appears that somehow the starter pinion > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. I'm wondering if the chain of events was the reverse, i.e. the starter casting cracked, allowing the pinion to climb out of the ring gear. There is a considerable force spreading those gears apart when the pinion is driving the ring gear. There's even more if the pinion doesn't disengage soon enough, so that the ring gear drives the pinion momentarily. The starter housing may have developed a fatigue crack that eventually spread far enough to allow the gears to push themselves apart. It's also possible that the pinion had not been disengaging properly for a while, which might have led to the fatigue crack in the first place. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org On Sun, 3 Feb 2002, George Worden wrote: > After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the > starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear > but the starter is toast. > Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, the > starter was not loose on its mounts. > > George Worden > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From 2w at telus.net Sat Feb 2 16:43:15 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (Bill Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: Message-ID: <001201c1ac4b$d03a7060$ace8b440@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello George There is a a sky-tec starter new on www. e-bay.com present bid is $192.00 USD. Regards Bill Robson From ebowhay at jetstream.net Sat Feb 2 20:23:46 2002 From: ebowhay at jetstream.net (Eustace Bowhay) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: Message-ID: <000001c1ac6b$b78af560$acbb17cf@ebowhay> Hi George: Had a crack start near one of the bolts on my original starter some years back. As I recall I called Sky Tec and returned the starter to them and they replaced it with one that had a heavier casting, believe they gave me some credit for the cracked one. Will try to run the paper trail down on this in the next day or so and let you know if I have the details right, in any event it wouldn't hurt to give them a call. Eustace ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Worden" To: Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 4:07 PM Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the > starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear > but the starter is toast. > Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, the > starter was not loose on its mounts. > > George Worden > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From wordeng at telus.net Sat Feb 2 20:24:03 2002 From: wordeng at telus.net (George Worden) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: <000001c1ac6b$b78af560$acbb17cf@ebowhay> Message-ID: <000a01c1ac6a$9d282810$f206b38e@ibmfb11191> Eustace: Thanks for the information.I will give them a call. However in this case there is no indication of a previous crack- just looks like a single overload. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eustace Bowhay" To: Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 9:23 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > Hi George: > > Had a crack start near one of the bolts on my original starter some years > back. As I recall I called Sky Tec and returned the starter to them and > they replaced it with one that had a heavier casting, believe they gave me > some credit for the cracked one. > > Will try to run the paper trail down on this in the next day or so and let > you know if I have the details right, in any event it wouldn't hurt to give > them a call. > > Eustace > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "George Worden" > To: > Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 4:07 PM > Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > > > > After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the > > starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion > > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear > > but the starter is toast. > > Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, > the > > starter was not loose on its mounts. > > > > George Worden > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Sat Feb 2 23:34:43 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: Message-ID: <01ff01c1ac85$41398100$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Is there any chance that the starter gear was not the same tooth pitch as the ring gear. I know they come in two sizes and I don't even know if they can be bolted together if they're not.... Scott in Vancouver Thanks for the ride last summer and talking me through my back-seat landing.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Worden" To: Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 4:07 PM Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the > starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear > but the starter is toast. > Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, the > starter was not loose on its mounts. > > George Worden > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at mchenry.ca Sat Feb 2 21:24:50 2002 From: tedd at mchenry.ca (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP In-Reply-To: <000a01c1ac6a$9d282810$f206b38e@ibmfb11191> Message-ID: > However in > this case there is no indication of a previous crack- just looks like a > single overload. George: In that case, my guess for a cause would be that a piece of debris got in between the gears and forced them apart. I've heard of that spliting a whole transmission in two; if so it could definitely crack your starter housing. Tedd From hwregget at shaw.ca Sun Feb 3 09:49:50 2002 From: hwregget at shaw.ca (Harv Wregget) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Jabiru Engines References: Message-ID: <007201c1acdb$2deb5fa0$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> Tedd McHenry, I read your message on Jabiru Engines last year and now I wonder if you might offer an opinion on the aero diesel engine under development now. Except for possible cold weather starting problems, it sounds ideal to me. Am I missing something? Here is the link: http://www.deltahawkengines.com/econom00.htm Thanks, Harv Wregget From tedd at vansairforce.org Sun Feb 3 10:46:06 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Jabiru Engines In-Reply-To: <007201c1acdb$2deb5fa0$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> Message-ID: Harv: I haven't been following the DeltaHawk, specifically, all that closely. But I think diesel aircraft engines have a very strong future. There's a good article about some of the European diesel aircraft engines in the November, 2001 issue of Flyer, a magazine from the UK. Reading between the lines, it appears that diesel aircraft engines are a done deal, so far as the Europeans are concerned. Because of the diesel's greater efficiency, and especially because of the fuel taxes in Europe, the cost savings with a diesel are enormous over there. However, the economics of diesels in North America is quite different. Europeans are prepared to pay more, up front, for a diesel engine, with the promise of significantly lower operating costs. The European diesel manufacturers aren't claiming that they can match the up-front price of a Lycoming. In North America, however, with a much lower cost of fuel, customers are more interested in up-front cost. This is particularly true in the homebuilt market. It appears that a lot of what drives the experimental engine movement in North America is the goal of lower up-front cost than a Lycoming, or perhaps better performance for the same cost. Consider the two most popular new engines for RVs, the Chevy V6 and the Mazda rotary. Neither engine can match a Lycoming's fuel efficiency. But either one can give you similar performance for less money or, in the case of the rotary, and with some engineering, better performance for about the same money. The goal of the NASA/GAP diesel engine program is somewhere between the European model and the V6/rotary model. They're aiming to keep the cost down through lower parts count (and government-subsidized development!), and gain the fuel efficiency advantages of a diesel for about the same up-front cost as a Lycoming, maybe a bit lower. I don't know where the DeltaHawk fits into that picture. To be successful, I think they need to sell for not just less than list price for a Lycoming, but also less than the discounted price that most Lycoming customers get these days, through Van's, Lancair, Sequoia, or whomever. That will be very hard to do, since the development cost of a Lycoming is already amortized long ago. Also, the heavily discounted price that Van's and other companies get make it clear that Textron-Lycoming is milking the piston engine market, and will drop their list prices significantly if they ever get much competition. To me that makes what DeltaHawk is trying to do very difficult. I believe the best hope for a viable alternative to Lycomings in the 150-200 Hp range, which the homebuilt market badly needs, lies in two areas. The first is engines built overseas, in places with lower cost of production. The Jabiru is the best example I know of. With the Australian dollar hovering around 50 cents U.S., and using modern design and manufacturing techniques, Jabiru can produce a superior engine for less cost. They're already doing this in the 80-120 HP range. The new 180 HP engine will probably prove to be superior to a Lycoming also, and at a lower price, although it's obviously too early to claim that yet. The second place we'll get alternatives to Lycoming is in home-grown development of auto conversions, and the leading candidate there is the Mazda rotary. Rotary homebuilders are beginning to organize themselves along the lines of the open-source software movement. This is a very efficient way to do engineering development, and I have very high hope for this movement. In much the same way that open source software provides a viable alternative to the near-monopoly of Microsoft (including, for example, the software that runs this email group), a homebuilder-based movement of rotary engine deveopment could provide a viable alternative to the near-monopoly of Lycoming in the 150-200 HP engine market. As for the technical merit of the DeltaHawk engine, I can't really comment because I haven't looked at it that closely. Tedd From hwregget at shaw.ca Sun Feb 3 20:26:40 2002 From: hwregget at shaw.ca (Harv Wregget) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] DeltaHawk Diesel References: Message-ID: <000601c1ad34$24e55b00$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> Thanks for the quick reply Tedd. DeltaHawk plans to sell their 200 hp engine for $18,000 US, about 2/3 the cost of the IO360A2. It sounds too good to be true, but just in case their numbers prove correct, I have listed myself with them for delivery for no money down. Now I better get to work on a RV 8. Thanks again, Harv ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2002 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] Re: Jabiru Engines > Harv: > > I haven't been following the DeltaHawk, specifically, all that closely. But I > think diesel aircraft engines have a very strong future. There's a good > article about some of the European diesel aircraft engines in the November, > 2001 issue of Flyer, a magazine from the UK. Reading between the lines, it > appears that diesel aircraft engines are a done deal, so far as the Europeans > are concerned. Because of the diesel's greater efficiency, and especially > because of the fuel taxes in Europe, the cost savings with a diesel are > enormous over there. > > However, the economics of diesels in North America is quite different. > Europeans are prepared to pay more, up front, for a diesel engine, with the > promise of significantly lower operating costs. The European diesel > manufacturers aren't claiming that they can match the up-front price of a > Lycoming. In North America, however, with a much lower cost of fuel, customers > are more interested in up-front cost. This is particularly true in the > homebuilt market. It appears that a lot of what drives the experimental engine > movement in North America is the goal of lower up-front cost than a Lycoming, > or perhaps better performance for the same cost. Consider the two most popular > new engines for RVs, the Chevy V6 and the Mazda rotary. Neither engine can > match a Lycoming's fuel efficiency. But either one can give you similar > performance for less money or, in the case of the rotary, and with some > engineering, better performance for about the same money. > > The goal of the NASA/GAP diesel engine program is somewhere between the > European model and the V6/rotary model. They're aiming to keep the cost down > through lower parts count (and government-subsidized development!), and gain > the fuel efficiency advantages of a diesel for about the same up-front cost as > a Lycoming, maybe a bit lower. I don't know where the DeltaHawk fits into that > picture. To be successful, I think they need to sell for not just less than > list price for a Lycoming, but also less than the discounted price that most > Lycoming customers get these days, through Van's, Lancair, Sequoia, or > whomever. That will be very hard to do, since the development cost of a > Lycoming is already amortized long ago. Also, the heavily discounted price > that Van's and other companies get make it clear that Textron-Lycoming is > milking the piston engine market, and will drop their list prices significantly > if they ever get much competition. To me that makes what DeltaHawk is trying > to do very difficult. > > I believe the best hope for a viable alternative to Lycomings in the 150-200 Hp > range, which the homebuilt market badly needs, lies in two areas. The first is > engines built overseas, in places with lower cost of production. The Jabiru is > the best example I know of. With the Australian dollar hovering around 50 > cents U.S., and using modern design and manufacturing techniques, Jabiru can > produce a superior engine for less cost. They're already doing this in the > 80-120 HP range. The new 180 HP engine will probably prove to be superior to a > Lycoming also, and at a lower price, although it's obviously too early to claim > that yet. The second place we'll get alternatives to Lycoming is in home-grown > development of auto conversions, and the leading candidate there is the Mazda > rotary. Rotary homebuilders are beginning to organize themselves along the > lines of the open-source software movement. This is a very efficient way to do > engineering development, and I have very high hope for this movement. In much > the same way that open source software provides a viable alternative to the > near-monopoly of Microsoft (including, for example, the software that runs this > email group), a homebuilder-based movement of rotary engine deveopment could > provide a viable alternative to the near-monopoly of Lycoming in the 150-200 HP > engine market. > > As for the technical merit of the DeltaHawk engine, I can't really comment > because I haven't looked at it that closely. > > Tedd > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From hwregget at shaw.ca Sun Feb 3 20:38:09 2002 From: hwregget at shaw.ca (Harv Wregget) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re-subscribe Message-ID: <002701c1ad35$bfe348a0$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> I think I am still on your member list, but I took myself off your mailing list last year due to all the junk mail and viruses. My e-mail has changed since then; I have changed from @home.com to @shaw.ca. I'd re-subscribe myself but I can't get into your site. I don't remember my password. Can you help? Harv Wregget -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020203/dfb08c2b/attachment.htm From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Sun Feb 3 20:04:16 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: Message-ID: <001a01c1ad31$04a1cd40$be19b8a1@dgmurray> I hate to be the one that points to the real trouble - BUT- I have seen this many times and it happens right after someone inadvertantly engages the starter AFTER the engine is already running - usually right while they are checking the mags on run up and returning the key to the both position. If the key goes past the run postion and hits the start mode the drive gear will hit the ring gear and the nose housing gets broken. If the housing is lucky enough to survive then the armature windings may get spun off from being spun to fast. Hope this helps, Doug Murray C-GRPA Flying and up to 13 hours - I do wish the wind would calm down so I can aviate some more:-)) ----- Original Message ----- From: Tedd McHenry To: Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 10:24 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > > However in > > this case there is no indication of a previous crack- just looks like a > > single overload. > > George: > > In that case, my guess for a cause would be that a piece of debris got in > between the gears and forced them apart. I've heard of that spliting a whole > transmission in two; if so it could definitely crack your starter housing. > > Tedd > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From rv7 at b4.ca Sun Feb 3 22:41:57 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] DeltaHawk Diesel References: <000601c1ad34$24e55b00$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <3C5E2D35.7090107@b4.ca> Does Deltahawk have a website? At $18KUS it's a just a dream in my mind, but what the heck, no point in discounting anything when i'm at least four years from needing it... 8-) Rob Prior RV-7 Empennage Harv Wregget wrote: >Thanks for the quick reply Tedd. DeltaHawk plans to sell their 200 hp >engine for $18,000 US, about 2/3 the cost of the IO360A2. It sounds too >good to be true, but just in case their numbers prove correct, I have listed >myself with them for delivery for no money down. Now I better get to work >on a RV 8. > >Thanks again, > >Harv > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Tedd McHenry" >To: >Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2002 10:46 AM >Subject: Re: [Wing] Re: Jabiru Engines > > >>Harv: >> >>I haven't been following the DeltaHawk, specifically, all that closely. >> >But I > >>think diesel aircraft engines have a very strong future. There's a good >>article about some of the European diesel aircraft engines in the >> >November, > >>2001 issue of Flyer, a magazine from the UK. Reading between the lines, >> >it > >>appears that diesel aircraft engines are a done deal, so far as the >> >Europeans > >>are concerned. Because of the diesel's greater efficiency, and especially >>because of the fuel taxes in Europe, the cost savings with a diesel are >>enormous over there. >> >>However, the economics of diesels in North America is quite different. >>Europeans are prepared to pay more, up front, for a diesel engine, with >> >the > >>promise of significantly lower operating costs. The European diesel >>manufacturers aren't claiming that they can match the up-front price of a >>Lycoming. In North America, however, with a much lower cost of fuel, >> >customers > >>are more interested in up-front cost. This is particularly true in the >>homebuilt market. It appears that a lot of what drives the experimental >> >engine > >>movement in North America is the goal of lower up-front cost than a >> >Lycoming, > >>or perhaps better performance for the same cost. Consider the two most >> >popular > >>new engines for RVs, the Chevy V6 and the Mazda rotary. Neither engine >> >can > >>match a Lycoming's fuel efficiency. But either one can give you similar >>performance for less money or, in the case of the rotary, and with some >>engineering, better performance for about the same money. >> >>The goal of the NASA/GAP diesel engine program is somewhere between the >>European model and the V6/rotary model. They're aiming to keep the cost >> >down > >>through lower parts count (and government-subsidized development!), and >> >gain > >>the fuel efficiency advantages of a diesel for about the same up-front >> >cost as > >>a Lycoming, maybe a bit lower. I don't know where the DeltaHawk fits into >> >that > >>picture. To be successful, I think they need to sell for not just less >> >than > >>list price for a Lycoming, but also less than the discounted price that >> >most > >>Lycoming customers get these days, through Van's, Lancair, Sequoia, or >>whomever. That will be very hard to do, since the development cost of a >>Lycoming is already amortized long ago. Also, the heavily discounted >> >price > >>that Van's and other companies get make it clear that Textron-Lycoming is >>milking the piston engine market, and will drop their list prices >> >significantly > >>if they ever get much competition. To me that makes what DeltaHawk is >> >trying > >>to do very difficult. >> >>I believe the best hope for a viable alternative to Lycomings in the >> >150-200 Hp > >>range, which the homebuilt market badly needs, lies in two areas. The >> >first is > >>engines built overseas, in places with lower cost of production. The >> >Jabiru is > >>the best example I know of. With the Australian dollar hovering around 50 >>cents U.S., and using modern design and manufacturing techniques, Jabiru >> >can > >>produce a superior engine for less cost. They're already doing this in >> >the > >>80-120 HP range. The new 180 HP engine will probably prove to be superior >> >to a > >>Lycoming also, and at a lower price, although it's obviously too early to >> >claim > >>that yet. The second place we'll get alternatives to Lycoming is in >> >home-grown > >>development of auto conversions, and the leading candidate there is the >> >Mazda > >>rotary. Rotary homebuilders are beginning to organize themselves along >> >the > >>lines of the open-source software movement. This is a very efficient way >> >to do > >>engineering development, and I have very high hope for this movement. In >> >much > >>the same way that open source software provides a viable alternative to >> >the > >>near-monopoly of Microsoft (including, for example, the software that runs >> >this > >>email group), a homebuilder-based movement of rotary engine deveopment >> >could > >>provide a viable alternative to the near-monopoly of Lycoming in the >> >150-200 HP > >>engine market. >> >>As for the technical merit of the DeltaHawk engine, I can't really comment >>because I haven't looked at it that closely. >> >>Tedd >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Wing mailing list >>Wing@vansairforce.org >>http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing >> > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > -- --------- Rob Prior rv7 "at" b4.ca ----------------------------- Stop dreaming... Start flying From rtaylor at telus.net Mon Feb 4 13:27:04 2002 From: rtaylor at telus.net (Roy Taylor) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] New E-mail address Message-ID: <3C5EFCA7.E846AA5C@telus.net> Hi everyone: We now have a new email address effective February 1, 2002. New address: rtaylor@telus.net Thank you....Pauline & Roy -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020204/9128dda4/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Feb 5 06:23:49 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] RVs in Western Canada Message-ID: Thanks to some research by Wing member Linda Todd, of Abbotsford, we have some interesting statistics on RV ownership in B.C., Alberta, and Saskatchewan. In those provinces, two-thirds of the owners of registered RVs are Wing members. There are 56 registered RVs and, based on the number under construction, that number will nearly double in the next few years! And that only counts RVs under construction by Wing members. There are many more under construction by non-members. BC AB SK total registered RVs 38 10 8 56 Wing members with registered RV 28 4 5 37 Wing members with RV under const. 31 14 5 50 (This table is best displayed in a monospace font, e.g. Courier.) --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From bdavies at pacificcoast.net Tue Feb 5 11:19:22 2002 From: bdavies at pacificcoast.net (Beatrice Davies) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] RVs in Western Canada References: Message-ID: <000701c1ae7a$04c2c140$de224d18@gv.shawcable.net> Could we please be taken off the mail list again. We will rejoin at a future date. Thank you ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 6:23 AM Subject: [Wing] RVs in Western Canada > Thanks to some research by Wing member Linda Todd, of Abbotsford, we have some > interesting statistics on RV ownership in B.C., Alberta, and Saskatchewan. > > In those provinces, two-thirds of the owners of registered RVs are Wing > members. There are 56 registered RVs and, based on the number under > construction, that number will nearly double in the next few years! And that > only counts RVs under construction by Wing members. There are many more under > construction by non-members. > > > > BC AB SK total > > registered RVs 38 10 8 56 > > Wing members with registered RV 28 4 5 37 > > Wing members with RV under const. 31 14 5 50 > > > > > (This table is best displayed in a monospace font, e.g. Courier.) > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Feb 6 13:57:11 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building Message-ID: I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If nothing else, it should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want to do it. However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it comfortably. I'm working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, etc.). So I could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet spacing from wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, to me. (In case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on whether the space I have is adequate? Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From reagleston at ibigroup.com Wed Feb 6 14:39:29 2002 From: reagleston at ibigroup.com (Ron Eagleston) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tedd, I built my 8A wings simultaneously in my 11' wide garage that had 2' shelves along one wall. I had about 3' clear between jigs. I think it was worth doing it that way. Ron Rebel flying 8A finishing > From: Tedd McHenry > Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org > Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 13:57:11 -0800 (PST) > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building > > > I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea > appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If nothing else, it > should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite > significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want to do it. > > However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it comfortably. I'm > working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". > Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the > moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, etc.). So I > could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet spacing from > wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, to me. (In > case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a > straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) > > Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on whether the > space > I have is adequate? > > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From ve7fp at jetstream.net Wed Feb 6 15:47:03 2002 From: ve7fp at jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: Message-ID: <006701c1af69$4daa0720$b2bb17cf@kenhoshowski> Tedd, If I were building another RV I would definately build both wings at the same time. It is much easier to fabricate a left and a right gusset at the same time, or numerous other parts. I seem to recall making two right hand instead of one left and one right because there were 6 months between wings and I didn't pay attention to the fact that I was now building the opposite wing to the drawings. Couple of suggestions, when drilling rib attach brackets take a look under the spar to see what you are drilling into and when predrilling holes in brackets don't assume all the holes in all the brackets will be in the same place. Those of you who have prepunched parts need not worry about this but those of us who didn't learned the hard way. Ken RV6 C-FKEH Salmon Arm B.C. First flight Sept.8,1993 Tedd McHenry said: > I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. From arrvee at vcn.bc.ca Wed Feb 6 16:23:39 2002 From: arrvee at vcn.bc.ca (arrvee) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building Message-ID: <001001c1af6d$c2b7b540$974066cf@arrvee> Ted When I built mine I had 3 feet between centers but the bottom surfaces of the wing faced each other Larry -----Original Message----- From: Tedd McHenry To: Western Canada Wing List Date: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 2:32 PM Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building >I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea >appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If nothing else, it >should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite >significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want to do it. > >However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it comfortably. I'm >working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". >Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the >moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, etc.). So I >could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet spacing from >wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, to me. (In >case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a >straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) > >Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on whether the space >I have is adequate? > > >Tedd McHenry >Van's Air Force >Western Canada Wing >tedd@vansairforce.org >www.vansairforce.org > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From haywire at telus.net Wed Feb 6 18:23:19 2002 From: haywire at telus.net (Haywire) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ted; I built my RV-9 wings simultaneously and it worked out great. Even on the pre-punch kits, there are many parts to fabricate and it is easier to make both at the same time. When you do it this way you will do all the pro-seal together (hey, it's really not that bad of stuff), rivet skins on together so you only need a helper once, and then build the jig and do both ailerons & flaps together. I must admit though that I am blessed with a large shop, so space wasn't an issue. S. Todd Bartrim 13B rotary powered RV-9 (finish kit) C-FSTB (reserved) > -----Original Message----- > From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On > Behalf Of Tedd McHenry > Sent: February 6, 2002 1:57 PM > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building > > > I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea > appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If > nothing else, it > should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite > significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want > to do it. > > However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it > comfortably. I'm > working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". > Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the > moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, > etc.). So I > could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet > spacing from > wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, > to me. (In > case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a > straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) > > Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on > whether the space > I have is adequate? > > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tgannon at stoneboat.com Tue Feb 5 20:09:09 2002 From: tgannon at stoneboat.com (Terence Gannon) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tedd -- you saw my shop while you were still living in Alberta, so you know how small a space I'm working in...but for the rest of the list, I have a one-and-a-half car garage, a sport-ute, and winters that dictate parking it inside at least six months of the year. So I'm working in a space not much wider than six feet, so both wings at once is not an option. However, for anybody else that might be in the same situation, I can offer a hint -- wherever possible, do the sub-assemblies for both wings at the same time. So in my case, I'm just about done with the left wing, but the right wing is pretty well along, as well. Both ailerons are built, both flaps are pretty much done, both sets of ribs are primed, every bracket and other part that is mirrored on both wings is done, and of course, all the jigs only have to be built once. So I'm assuming the second wing will go very quickly...it's not quite in quick build, but it will go one heckuva lot faster than the first. In an event, if lack of space is your concern, it shouldn't be. Where there is a will, there is a way. Terry in Calgary RV-6 S/N 24414 "Wings" From guyb at shaw.ca Wed Feb 6 22:09:42 2002 From: guyb at shaw.ca (Guy Bourgeois) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: Message-ID: <000401c1af9e$088cbfe0$ba9d4018@guys> Hi Terry, Where in Calgary are you? I recently started building RV7. I live in Somerset and have been building in a shop near Heritage Point. Would like to talk to other RV builders in Calgary. Cheers, Guy From acornyn at telusplanet.net Wed Feb 6 22:31:50 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: Message-ID: <004001c1afa1$21184a40$601bb8a1@USER> Definitely build both at the same time iven if you have to move the kitchen table. If you screw up both wings equally it will fly straight. Mine does. Al RV-6 Flying Installing UPS MX20 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 2:57 PM Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building > I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea > appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If nothing else, it > should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite > significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want to do it. > > However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it comfortably. I'm > working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". > Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the > moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, etc.). So I > could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet spacing from > wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, to me. (In > case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a > straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) > > Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on whether the space > I have is adequate? > > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From gmouck at attcanada.ca Wed Feb 6 23:51:48 2002 From: gmouck at attcanada.ca (gmouck) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: <000401c1af9e$088cbfe0$ba9d4018@guys> Message-ID: <002b01c1afac$4cae1f80$4449b5cf@hppav> Guy, I am working on the wiring of an RV9 and only live about 5 miles from Heritage Pointe. If you want to pop over and have a look, give me a call. My number is 938-2498. Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: "Guy Bourgeois" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building > Hi Terry, > Where in Calgary are you? I recently started building RV7. I live in > Somerset and have been building in a shop near Heritage Point. Would like to > talk to other RV builders in Calgary. > Cheers, > Guy > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Feb 7 06:33:30 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building In-Reply-To: <002b01c1afac$4cae1f80$4449b5cf@hppav> Message-ID: Thanks very much to everyone who replied to my question about simultaneous wing building. It seems almost unanimous that it's the way to go. As a bonus, it looks like the thread of messages will result in a few builders in Calgary getting to know each other! What more could I ask for? --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Feb 7 07:09:43 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-in 2002 Message-ID: The Langley Aero Club and Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing are holding a fly-in for RVs on Saturday, June 8, 2002 at Langley airport (CYNJ). This is shaping up to be a really good event, with some fantastic features already planned, and probably more to come. Keep an eye on the Fly-in web page for details, http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ Perhaps you're already the proud owner of a flying RV. Lucky you! Then you'll surely want to fly in for a chance to win the People's Choice award for the best RV, and to show off your beautiful airplane. There will be plenty of space on the field for parking. You can camp on the field, or stay in one of the hotels near the airport. We'll be posting information about accommodation on the Wing web site over the next few weeks. Currently building an RV? Then you're probably thinking a lot about those first flights. We're going to have Mike Seager, Van's authorized RV transition training instructor, available for transition instruction in his RV-6. For more information, or to schedule instruction, contact Mike Seager between 7:00am and 9:00am Pacific Time at (503) 429-5103. Mike can also be reached via e-mail at rv6cfi@vernonia.com. You'll also enjoy the seminar on engines, by Bart Lalonde of Aero Sport Power, and RV safety, by Eustace Bowhay. We are very fortunate to have these two highly respected aviation professionals come to our fly in. Are you an RV wannabe? Seriously thinking about building one, but unsure about what's involved, the cost, the time commitment? Worried that you don't have the skills? Then you'll be interested in talking to the representative from Van's Aircraft who will be there, and attending the seminar I'll be giving, "Introduction to RV Building." The seminar will cover those basic questions, and others, and will be a place where you can ask whatever's on your mind about the building process, and maybe even try a little practise rivetting. If you just like to look at RVs, this is probably going to be your best chance inside Canada this year. There are 38 RVs registered in B.C., and we hope to have a sizeable proportion of them at Langley. We've been contacted by groups as far away as Saskatchewan and southern California who've expressed an interest in flying in with their RVs. So we expect a great turn out, and some really interesting RVs to look at. Naturally, we're encouraging anyone who wants to fly in, regardless of what type of airplane they have. If you plan to attend, and especially if you plan to fly in, please take the time to write me at tedd@vansairforce.org or, if you prefer, sign the Guest Book on the Fly-in web page. http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/guestbook/lac_sign.html That will help us plan facilities such as food, washrooms, and customs for U.S. visitors. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From guyb at shaw.ca Thu Feb 7 09:54:55 2002 From: guyb at shaw.ca (Guy Bourgeois) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:15 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: <000401c1af9e$088cbfe0$ba9d4018@guys> <002b01c1afac$4cae1f80$4449b5cf@hppav> Message-ID: <001401c1b000$8d211a50$709d4018@guys> Hi Gary, Sure would like to go over and see what you are up to with your RV9. I will call you or feel free to call me at anytime. My numbers: Res: 640-6232 Cell: 560-3872 Cheers, Guy From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Feb 15 07:03:23 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV-6A Plans For Sale Message-ID: A couple of days ago someone posted an ad for RV-6A plans. You can see the ad at http://www.vansairforce.org/classifieds --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From m.speer at shaw.ca Mon Feb 18 22:05:27 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Getting going? Message-ID: <3C71EB27.859685B1@shaw.ca> What's the procedure for having the work inspected as we build our RV's. How do you go about getting the aircraft registered? Thanks Mike Speer From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Feb 19 06:39:36 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Getting going? In-Reply-To: <3C71EB27.859685B1@shaw.ca> Message-ID: > What's the procedure for having the work inspected as we build our > RV's. How do you go about getting the aircraft registered? > > Thanks Mike Speer Mike: You'll get the official answers from MD-RA (Minister's Delegates - Recreational Aircraft), the new organization that is now responsible for inspections and CofAs for amateur-built aircraft. http://www.md-ra.com/ Basically, you begin by filing a letter of intent to build an amateur-built aircraft. You file the letter with MD-RA. I believe you can do it through their web site, although the service is down at the moment. Later, at the appropriate time, you request inspections through them. In practice, it's probably smart to get to know your inspector well before any inspections. They're an invaluable source of information. Tedd McHenry From 2w at telus.net Tue Feb 19 10:35:29 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (Bill Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Getting going? References: Message-ID: <000401c1b974$350bdf80$3243e8d8@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello Tedd Thats good advise to get to know the inspector before you really need him. But how do you do that when they keep their names and phone numbers a secret ? Bill Robson From m.speer at shaw.ca Fri Feb 22 17:57:32 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 Message-ID: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with sliding canopy, electric flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a clue, at this point anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal online and have started to acquire some elementary tools. I know that I want to build this aircraft however at this point I do not have the necessary skill to do the job. If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking bar I would like to get some hands on training. Thanks ...Mike Speer From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Feb 22 18:10:40 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 In-Reply-To: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> Message-ID: > If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > Thanks ...Mike Speer Mike: I don't have any bucking coming up in the immediate future, but you're welcome to stop by, see my project, and talk turkey about building. I'm in Cloverdale, not far away from Richmond. Tedd McHenry From rv7 at b4.ca Fri Feb 22 18:29:30 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: Message-ID: <3C76FE8A.4030200@b4.ca> I'm a half-step ahead of Tedd on when i'll be riveting next, but a full step or two behind him in terms of overall progress... Seeing as i'm only on the tail, and he's getting ready for the wings. But i'm in the same boat you are, in that i've never done any riveting. There's a lot of work to do to get to this point, though, so don't be afraid to start. You'll probably be setting up your shop for the first month before you get anywhere close to wanting to rivet anything, and then you'll be doing preparatory work for the next month before you're ready to bang a rivet. -RB4 RV-7 Empennage Tedd McHenry wrote: >>If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking >>bar I would like to get some hands on training. >> >I don't have any bucking coming up in the immediate future, but you're welcome >to stop by, see my project, and talk turkey about building. I'm in Cloverdale, >not far away from Richmond. > From fvalarm at rapidnet.net Fri Feb 22 22:31:28 2002 From: fvalarm at rapidnet.net (B. Tomm) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <00c901c1bc33$baeaf980$bb8d35d1@cheryls> Mike, I'm building a 7A in Abbotsford, no help with bucking is needed at this point but you can visit if you want to come this far. Bevan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Speer" To: Sent: February 22, 2002 5:57 PM Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with sliding canopy, electric > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a clue, at this point > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal online and have > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know that I want to build > this aircraft however at this point I do not have the necessary skill to > do the job. > If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From acwrench at yahoo.ca Sat Feb 23 09:19:43 2002 From: acwrench at yahoo.ca (pat morency) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 In-Reply-To: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <20020223171943.66944.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Mike, I bought my tail feathers about 90% completed and the wing kit in the box with alot of tools I'd only heard about. Today I have the left wing in the jig the leading is drilled deburred and dimpled along with all the top and bottom skins. I've made a few mistakes along the way and had to go back and either correct or compensate for them. The best piece of advice I could give you is "Ask Questions" when you get stumped and don't be afraid to start. You might want to get a few pieces of sheet metal, drill some holes, deburr, and practice slammin' rivets. This whole project seems to be about READIN' and RIVETIN'. Best of Luck! Pat in Calgary --- Mike Speer wrote: > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with > sliding canopy, electric > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a > clue, at this point > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal > online and have > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know > that I want to build > this aircraft however at this point I do not have > the necessary skill to > do the job. > If there is anyone out there who needs to have > someone hold the bucking > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing ______________________________________________________________________ Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca From cliffada at telusplanet.net Sat Feb 23 21:45:06 2002 From: cliffada at telusplanet.net (Cliff Adams) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] re: Starting an RV7(A) Message-ID: <3C787DE2.30750190@telusplanet.net> I too had some doubts about riveting stuff but thanks to Barry Tunzlemann (working in Edmonton for a while) I got some fine tips and "how to's..." and a little dual on a rivet gun. The best I can offer right now is 1. Use a 3X gun at fairly low pressure... 40 to 80 PSI and tease the trigger gently to get the rivet started...make sure the bucking bar is held square to the work 2. It is essential the work is held firmly in place...nothing is worse than having the rivet set jump all over your nice new aluminum making smiles in the surface 3. Barry taught me to recognize and drill out bad rivets...practice how to do this as you will have a bad rivet or two for sure. A piece of masking tape on the end of the cupped rivet set (especially the 1/8" rivets) helps to protect the factory head nicely. 4. While a rhythm does develop when rivetting, I've found that the first few rivets always require some thought and care when driving. 5. The knowledge curve seems steep at times but you will become proficient...good building and best of luck Cliff Adams RV7A Emp (half done & 90% to go on the tail feathers) From m.speer at shaw.ca Sun Feb 24 00:22:15 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] re: starting a RV Message-ID: <3C78A2B7.A9AC7AB@shaw.ca> Thanks to all locally who have answered the call for help and made generous offers to let me come and see their projects. It's surprising how many aircraft are under construction and the wealth of information available. Thanks again ...Mike From acornyn at telusplanet.net Sun Feb 24 21:17:48 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] re: Starting an RV7(A) References: <3C787DE2.30750190@telusplanet.net> Message-ID: <002001c1bdbb$c4d1eab0$891cb8a1@USER> Don't set the gun too light because you will work harden the rivets then the don't squish worth a s___. But it is all worth it. Al RV6 flying with apollo mx20 just installed Can't get lost now.------- Original Message ----- From: "Cliff Adams" To: Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2002 10:45 PM Subject: [Wing] re: Starting an RV7(A) > I too had some doubts about riveting stuff but thanks to Barry > Tunzlemann (working in Edmonton for a while) I got some fine tips and > "how to's..." and a little dual on a rivet gun. The best I can offer > right now is > 1. Use a 3X gun at fairly low pressure... 40 to 80 PSI and tease the > trigger gently to get the rivet started...make sure the bucking bar is > held square to the work > 2. It is essential the work is held firmly in place...nothing is worse > than having the rivet set jump all over your nice new aluminum making > smiles in the surface > 3. Barry taught me to recognize and drill out bad rivets...practice how > to do this as you will have a bad rivet or two for sure. A piece of > masking tape on the end of the cupped rivet set (especially the 1/8" > rivets) helps to protect the factory head nicely. > 4. While a rhythm does develop when rivetting, I've found that the first > few rivets always require some thought and care when driving. > 5. The knowledge curve seems steep at times but you will become > proficient...good building and best of luck > > Cliff Adams RV7A Emp (half done & 90% to go on the tail feathers) > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From rtaylor at telus.net Sun Feb 24 23:03:43 2002 From: rtaylor at telus.net (Roy Taylor) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] re: starting a RV References: <3C78A2B7.A9AC7AB@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <3C79E1CF.68C2E300@telus.net> Hi Mike, I live in Richmond and in the final stages of building an RV6A. Give us a call, my home phone is 604 274 0258; Office 604 276 0550 Roy Taylor From patman at itdoesntsuck.com Mon Feb 25 10:34:15 2002 From: patman at itdoesntsuck.com (Pat Dayman) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.1.20020225133148.009e9aa0@pop3.norton.antivirus> While doing the annual inspection recently I realized that there was no air filter on my RV-4 (obviously I did not build this one) I got looking and can add one with a modification to the lower cowl. Not a big job, but any input anyone has as to running with/without the filter would be greatly appreciated. Pat Dayman CF-JOJ From fo320 at sympatico.ca Mon Feb 25 14:43:52 2002 From: fo320 at sympatico.ca (RV-4) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.1.20020225133148.009e9aa0@pop3.norton.antivirus> Message-ID: Hello Pat I've been flying my RV-4 (0-320 E2D) off a grass strip for the last 2 years without an air filter and so far I've had no problems.The only thing I did was to put a small metal screen in the air intake to catch the big pieces but nothing like a filter air box. I also have an Ellison Throttle boby injector installed which might make a difference. Hope this helps Bruno Dionne RV-4 C-GDBH Bellefeuille,Quebec ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------- -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On Behalf Of Pat Dayman Sent: February 25, 2002 1:34 PM To: wing@vansairforce.org Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter While doing the annual inspection recently I realized that there was no air filter on my RV-4 (obviously I did not build this one) I got looking and can add one with a modification to the lower cowl. Not a big job, but any input anyone has as to running with/without the filter would be greatly appreciated. Pat Dayman CF-JOJ _______________________________________________ Wing mailing list Wing@vansairforce.org http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From mdeg at shaw.ca Mon Feb 25 15:28:46 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter References: <5.1.0.14.1.20020225133148.009e9aa0@pop3.norton.antivirus> Message-ID: <004001c1be54$2c6177c0$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> I assume that you have the foam and screen on your -4.....While this is OK putting on the B&N filter which Van sells would be a definite improvement......the advantage is that you get filtered air all the time.....Engines cost way too much to overhaul and dirt etc. going through the carb (applying carb heat during runup) will shorten the life of your cylinders......In short I would not run without a filter... Marc DeGirolamo C-FRVE getting ready to do annual..... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pat Dayman" To: Sent: Monday, February 25, 2002 12:34 PM Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter > While doing the annual inspection recently I realized that there was no air > filter on my RV-4 (obviously I did not build this one) I got looking and > can add one with a modification to the lower cowl. Not a big job, but any > input anyone has as to running with/without the filter would be greatly > appreciated. > > Pat Dayman > CF-JOJ > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From acwrench at yahoo.ca Mon Feb 25 19:12:17 2002 From: acwrench at yahoo.ca (pat morency) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] backriveting Message-ID: <20020226031217.39716.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> To All, Has anyone out there backriveted the top skins of the wing and if so how? Read an article from Eric Henson and he refers to a Frank Justices instructions. Thanks Pat in Calgary ______________________________________________________________________ Find, Connect, Date! http://personals.yahoo.ca From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Tue Feb 26 06:18:57 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] backriveting References: <20020226031217.39716.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <005901c1bed0$8803a5e0$531bb8a1@dgmurray> Pat - I am now flying an RV-6 that I back riveted the wing top skins on. It looks real good and I feel was easier to build. I used the 15" backriveting set from Avery and the 3# bucking bar that looks a bit like the head of an overgrown nail. The 15" set reaches through the wing past the ribs from the bottom side and a helper holds the bucking bar against the top of the skin as the riveter sets the rivet. The helper removes the Clecos and inserts the rivets so the riveter can continue seting the rivets. I hope this helps - but if it isn't enough , please feel welcome to call me and talk about it. Doug Murray - RV-6 C-GRPA Mountain View, Alberta (about 2 hours south of Calgary) 403-653-2087 ----- Original Message ----- From: pat morency > To All, > Has anyone out there backriveted the top skins of the > wing and if so how? Read an article from Eric Henson > and he refers to a Frank Justices instructions. > Thanks > Pat in Calgary From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Feb 26 09:47:30 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Transition Training at Langley Fly-in Message-ID: One of the featured events at the Langley RV Fly-in (June 8) will be RV transition training. The training will be conducted by Mike Seager, the Vans-authorized transition pilot. I've taken Mike Seager's training, and I found it very worthwhile. We're now booking sessions with Mike for the weekend of the Fly-in. Mike will be available for three days, from Thursday, June 6 to Saturday, June 8, with about six flights per day. We expect this to be very popular, so I encourage you to book early while there are still slots left. Linda Todd is organizing the bookings, and can give you pricing information. Contact me off-list (i.e. at tedd@vansairforce.org) for Linda's phone number. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From m.speer at shaw.ca Tue Feb 26 23:43:46 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> <00c901c1bc33$baeaf980$bb8d35d1@cheryls> Message-ID: <3C7C8E32.A7269D67@shaw.ca> Hi Bevan, Thanks very much for the kind offer, it is quite frankly amazing how many aircraft are under construction in the Vancouver area. I will definitely give you a call and drop bye when it 's convenient. ..Mike "B. Tomm" wrote: > Mike, I'm building a 7A in Abbotsford, no help with bucking is needed at > this point but you can visit if you want to come this far. > > Bevan > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mike Speer" > To: > Sent: February 22, 2002 5:57 PM > Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 > > > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with sliding canopy, electric > > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a clue, at this point > > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal online and have > > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know that I want to build > > this aircraft however at this point I do not have the necessary skill to > > do the job. > > If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking > > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From m.speer at shaw.ca Tue Feb 26 23:53:35 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <20020223171943.66944.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3C7C907F.29385509@shaw.ca> Pat Thanks for the words of encouragement. Dropped in on a -6a project this week there are at least two that I know about in my neighborhood, amazing . I've stopped trying to convince myself and have made the order for the RV-7. I am a lot more comfortable since I joined the "wing" and have met a few builders, once I get a few thousand rivets under my belt it won't seem like such a big deal. I pass through YYC on a regular basis with my job so I will give you a call. Thanks.. Mike pat morency wrote: > Mike, > I bought my tail feathers about 90% completed and the > wing kit in the box with alot of tools I'd only heard > about. Today I have the left wing in the jig the > leading is drilled deburred and dimpled along with all > the top and bottom skins. I've made a few mistakes > along the way and had to go back and either correct or > compensate for them. The best piece of advice I could > give you is "Ask Questions" when you get stumped and > don't be afraid to start. You might want to get a few > pieces of sheet metal, drill some holes, deburr, and > practice slammin' rivets. This whole project seems to > be about READIN' and RIVETIN'. Best of Luck! > Pat in Calgary > --- Mike Speer wrote: > > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with > > sliding canopy, electric > > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a > > clue, at this point > > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal > > online and have > > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know > > that I want to build > > this aircraft however at this point I do not have > > the necessary skill to > > do the job. > > If there is anyone out there who needs to have > > someone hold the bucking > > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From jjewell at telus.net Wed Feb 27 00:51:53 2002 From: jjewell at telus.net (Jim Jewell) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <20020223171943.66944.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> <3C7C907F.29385509@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <001501c1bf6c$00cd1ce0$4d76e8d8@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello Mike, If you are going to be coming to Kelowna some time send me a warning so I can have the beverage of your choice on hand. My 6A is much done with a lot left to do yet. There are quite a few RVs in the Okanagan. If time permits some visiting, their owners like to show off their work almost as much as I do mine. It's a long drive so feel welcome to stay over a bit. Starting out on this adventure was so great!, The whole experience has been stupendous! I am hooked, I can't imagine not doing it again. I hope it' turns out the same for you. Jim in Kelowna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Speer" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 11:53 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 > Pat > > Thanks for the words of encouragement. Dropped in on a -6a project this > week there are at least two that I know about in my neighborhood, amazing > . I've stopped trying to convince myself and have made the order for the > RV-7. I am a lot more comfortable since I joined the "wing" and have met a > few builders, once I get a few thousand rivets under my belt it won't seem > like such a big deal. > > I pass through YYC on a regular basis with my job so I will give you a > call. > > Thanks.. Mike > > pat morency wrote: > > > Mike, > > I bought my tail feathers about 90% completed and the > > wing kit in the box with alot of tools I'd only heard > > about. Today I have the left wing in the jig the > > leading is drilled deburred and dimpled along with all > > the top and bottom skins. I've made a few mistakes > > along the way and had to go back and either correct or > > compensate for them. The best piece of advice I could > > give you is "Ask Questions" when you get stumped and > > don't be afraid to start. You might want to get a few > > pieces of sheet metal, drill some holes, deburr, and > > practice slammin' rivets. This whole project seems to > > be about READIN' and RIVETIN'. Best of Luck! > > Pat in Calgary > > --- Mike Speer wrote: > > > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with > > > sliding canopy, electric > > > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > > > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a > > > clue, at this point > > > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal > > > online and have > > > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know > > > that I want to build > > > this aircraft however at this point I do not have > > > the necessary skill to > > > do the job. > > > If there is anyone out there who needs to have > > > someone hold the bucking > > > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > > > > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wing mailing list > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From ve7fp at jetstream.net Wed Feb 27 15:38:31 2002 From: ve7fp at jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Oil Seperator Message-ID: <003b01c1bfe8$06a55160$b6bb17cf@kenhoshowski> For Sale: (used) As shown in 2001 Aircraft Spruce catalogue page 260, p/n 10570 $38.65 U.S.(approx $70 Cdn with exchange,customs and freight) $35.00 (I pay freight) Ken Hoshowski RV6 C-FKEH First flight Sept. 8,1993 From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Feb 27 20:21:52 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in Message-ID: As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV Fly-in (June 8). We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they don't yet know themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, but I thought I'd survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to see, and forward the result to Van's. If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to build, please let me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, the options are: -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. No, the -10 won't be ready! --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From briant at telus.net Wed Feb 27 23:19:39 2002 From: briant at telus.net (Brian W. Truitt) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <001b01c1c029$510a34a0$2ec134d1@a1a28765> -7 for me. Brian Truitt - RV-7 Fuselage up to the firewall now. ----- Original Message ----- From: Tedd McHenry To: Western Canada Wing List Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 8:21 PM Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV Fly-in (June 8). We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they don't yet know themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, but I thought I'd survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to see, and forward the result to Van's. If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to build, please let me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, the options are: -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. No, the -10 won't be ready! --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org _______________________________________________ Wing mailing list Wing@vansairforce.org http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020227/0b306c96/attachment.htm From nhunger at sprint.ca Thu Feb 28 03:52:58 2002 From: nhunger at sprint.ca (Norman) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <001c01c1c04e$81c15e00$f3e494d1@oemcomputer> RV7 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 8:21 PM Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in > As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV Fly-in (June 8). > We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they don't yet know > themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, but I thought I'd > survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to see, and forward > the result to Van's. > > If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and > especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to build, please let > me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, the options are: > -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. > > No, the -10 won't be ready! > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From rv7 at b4.ca Thu Feb 28 09:07:00 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <3C7E63B4.6080908@b4.ca> Since i'm building a -7, it's my first choice. But if the -9 is ready by then, i'd like to see it... -RB4 Tedd McHenry wrote: >As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV Fly-in (June 8). >We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they don't yet know >themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, but I thought I'd >survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to see, and forward >the result to Van's. > >If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and >especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to build, please let >me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, the options are: >-7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. > >No, the -10 won't be ready! > From guyb at shaw.ca Thu Feb 28 12:39:16 2002 From: guyb at shaw.ca (Guy Bourgeois) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: <3C7E63B4.6080908@b4.ca> Message-ID: <001201c1c097$fdd03540$769d4018@guys> Here's my vote: Let it be the RV7 Cheers, Guy From ltodd at telus.net Thu Feb 28 17:55:55 2002 From: ltodd at telus.net (Linda Todd) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <000901c1c0c4$52f38aa0$94e335d1@oemcomputer> I'd love to see the 7 again - didn't get a good enough look at it at Delta. 9A would be my second choice. Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 8:21 PM Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in > As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV Fly-in (June 8). > We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they don't yet know > themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, but I thought I'd > survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to see, and forward > the result to Van's. > > If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and > especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to build, please let > me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, the options are: > -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. > > No, the -10 won't be ready! > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Thu Feb 28 18:13:08 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <004b01c1c0c6$a1acd280$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Bob Cutting lives in Steveston and would be the man to call-he's just finishing his second RV Scott ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Speer" To: Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 5:57 PM Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with sliding canopy, electric > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a clue, at this point > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal online and have > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know that I want to build > this aircraft however at this point I do not have the necessary skill to > do the job. > If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Thu Feb 28 18:14:41 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: Message-ID: <005301c1c0c6$d89cd920$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> I'm near Crescent Park and am nearing the end of wiring my -6. Call or stop by anytime. Scott Jackson 2675 134th St ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 6:10 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 > > If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking > > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > Mike: > > I don't have any bucking coming up in the immediate future, but you're welcome > to stop by, see my project, and talk turkey about building. I'm in Cloverdale, > not far away from Richmond. > > Tedd McHenry > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From rob at tonnesen.com Mon Mar 4 22:05:08 2002 From: rob at tonnesen.com (Rob Tonnesen) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Now that the -9 is flying, it might be interesting it see that at the Langley fly-in. Later... Rob T. On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, Tedd McHenry wrote: > As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV Fly-in (June 8). > We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they don't yet know > themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, but I thought I'd > survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to see, and forward > the result to Van's. > > If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and > especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to build, please let > me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, the options are: > -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. > > No, the -10 won't be ready! > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From nhunger at sprint.ca Tue Mar 5 09:22:04 2002 From: nhunger at sprint.ca (Norman) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] RMI Monitor For Sale References: Message-ID: <000901c1c46a$45d2b9a0$8fe994d1@oemcomputer> Canadian Rocky Mountain Instrument engine monitor for sale. Landed in Delta BC with all taxes paid I'm into it for $2584 Canadian. This is the kit with every sensor that RMI sells to hook it up. I have done 99% of all the soldering but nothing else. All of the chips have yet to be installed. The box is packed with all of the sensors. Here's what I ordered: 1 101k Monitor Kit $999 1 Manifold Pressure Sensor $57 1 Fuel Flow Sensor $160 4 EGT Thermocouples $40 ea / $160 4 CHT Thermocouples $40 ea / $160 1 EGT/CHT Multiplex Switch $36 ***All these prices are US dollars*** Make an offer if you are interested. Thank-you, Norman Hunger Delta BC From rv7 at b4.ca Tue Mar 5 09:28:27 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] RMI Monitor For Sale References: <000901c1c46a$45d2b9a0$8fe994d1@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <3C85003B.4090502@b4.ca> I was considering this setup for my -7, when the time comes. Why have you decided not to use it? -Rob Prior RV-7 Empennage Norman wrote: >Canadian Rocky Mountain Instrument engine monitor for sale. Landed in Delta >BC with all taxes paid I'm into it for $2584 Canadian. This is the kit with >every sensor that RMI sells to hook it up. > >I have done 99% of all the soldering but nothing else. All of the chips have >yet to be installed. The box is packed with all of the sensors. > >Here's what I ordered: > >1 101k Monitor Kit $999 >1 Manifold Pressure Sensor $57 >1 Fuel Flow Sensor $160 >4 EGT Thermocouples $40 ea / $160 >4 CHT Thermocouples $40 ea / $160 >1 EGT/CHT Multiplex Switch $36 >***All these prices are US dollars*** > >Make an offer if you are interested. > From nhunger at sprint.ca Tue Mar 5 09:31:43 2002 From: nhunger at sprint.ca (Norman) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers References: Message-ID: <000f01c1c46b$9ea765c0$8fe994d1@oemcomputer> Could some one please pass on the dimensions of one of the T-hangers at Langley BC? I'm researching buying one soon to clear up room to finish my project. I have moved and managed to aquire another hot rod, need storage space. Are the T-hangers big enough for cars/boats? I talked to the airport manager and he said the hangers are supposed to be for aircraft only but he generally looks the other way. Some basic research on hangers has turned me off my favorite airport: Boundary Bay. It's half the drive than Langley for me and comes equipped with customs but their prices are way too high. I was quoted $44,000 for a 30 year lease on a brand new T-hanger with power, water, and phone. Operating costs including property tax would be an additional $2000 a year. So far I've been told it's around $25,000 for a used T-hanger at Langley with annual maintenance fees much less. Can anyone elaborate for me? Actual costs and dimensions please? Power and water? Thank-you, Norman Hunger RV6A Delta BC From reagleston at ibigroup.com Tue Mar 5 13:01:35 2002 From: reagleston at ibigroup.com (Ron Eagleston) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers In-Reply-To: <000f01c1c46b$9ea765c0$8fe994d1@oemcomputer> Message-ID: Norman, They are in the process of building new hangers at Pitt Meadows, I can't remember the cost but it was definitely cheaper than Boundry Bay's. Ron Rebel flying/8A finishing > From: "Norman" > Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org > Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 09:31:43 -0800 > To: > Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers > > > Could some one please pass on the dimensions of one of the T-hangers at > Langley BC? I'm researching buying one soon to clear up room to finish my > project. I have moved and managed to aquire another hot rod, need storage > space. Are the T-hangers big enough for cars/boats? I talked to the airport > manager and he said the hangers are supposed to be for aircraft only but he > generally looks the other way. > > Some basic research on hangers has turned me off my favorite airport: > Boundary Bay. It's half the drive than Langley for me and comes equipped > with customs but their prices are way too high. I was quoted $44,000 for a > 30 year lease on a brand new T-hanger with power, water, and phone. > Operating costs including property tax would be an additional $2000 a year. > > So far I've been told it's around $25,000 for a used T-hanger at Langley > with annual maintenance fees much less. Can anyone elaborate for me? Actual > costs and dimensions please? Power and water? > > Thank-you, > Norman Hunger > RV6A Delta BC > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From haywire at telus.net Tue Mar 5 17:36:55 2002 From: haywire at telus.net (Haywire) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I agree. My vote is for the "9". S. Todd Bartrim 13B rotary powered RV-9 (finish kit) C-FSTB (reserved) http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > Now that the -9 is flying, it might be interesting it see that at the > Langley fly-in. > > Later... > Rob T. > > On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, Tedd McHenry wrote: > > > As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV > Fly-in (June 8). > > We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they > don't yet know > > themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, > but I thought I'd > > survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to > see, and forward > > the result to Van's. > > > > If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and > > especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to > build, please let > > me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, > the options are: > > -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. > > > > No, the -10 won't be ready! > > > > --- > > > > Tedd McHenry > > Van's Air Force > > Western Canada Wing > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From gordjack at telus.net Tue Mar 5 21:33:06 2002 From: gordjack at telus.net (Gordon Jack) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <3C85AA12.84224EEC@telus.net> Todd I think your opinion may be biassed somewhat. :-) ;-) Gord Jack RV 7a 70011 (wings) Haywire wrote: > I agree. My vote is for the "9". > > S. Todd Bartrim > 13B rotary powered > RV-9 (finish kit) > C-FSTB (reserved) > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > > > > > Now that the -9 is flying, it might be interesting it see that at the > > Langley fly-in. > > > > Later... > > Rob T. > > > > On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, Tedd McHenry wrote: > > > > > As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV > > Fly-in (June 8). > > > We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they > > don't yet know > > > themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, > > but I thought I'd > > > survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to > > see, and forward > > > the result to Van's. > > > > > > If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and > > > especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to > > build, please let > > > me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, > > the options are: > > > -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. > > > > > > No, the -10 won't be ready! > > > > > > --- > > > > > > Tedd McHenry > > > Van's Air Force > > > Western Canada Wing > > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wing mailing list > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From haywire at telus.net Tue Mar 5 22:12:26 2002 From: haywire at telus.net (Haywire) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in In-Reply-To: <3C85AA12.84224EEC@telus.net> Message-ID: WHAT ME !!??? BIASED???? Now that's just crazy talk. Actually I just figured that alot of people have seen all their other demonstrators, so anything new is always a good thing. Besides I've already built my plane to be convertible from a TD to a TG, so I'm hoping to sneak a ride out of them. S. Todd Bartrim 13B rotary powered RV-9endurance (finish kit) C-FSTB (reserved) http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > -----Original Message----- > From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On > Behalf Of Gordon Jack > Sent: March 5, 2002 9:33 PM > To: wing@vansairforce.org > Subject: Re: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in > > > Todd > > I think your opinion may be biassed somewhat. :-) ;-) > > Gord Jack > RV 7a 70011 (wings) > > Haywire wrote: > > > I agree. My vote is for the "9". > > > > S. Todd Bartrim > > 13B rotary powered > > RV-9 (finish kit) > > C-FSTB (reserved) > > http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm > > > > > > > > > > Now that the -9 is flying, it might be interesting it see that at the > > > Langley fly-in. > > > > > > Later... > > > Rob T. > > > > > > On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, Tedd McHenry wrote: > > > > > > > As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV > > > Fly-in (June 8). > > > > We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they > > > don't yet know > > > > themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, > > > but I thought I'd > > > > survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to > > > see, and forward > > > > the result to Van's. > > > > > > > > If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if > you do, and > > > > especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to > > > build, please let > > > > me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, > > > the options are: > > > > -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. > > > > > > > > No, the -10 won't be ready! > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Tedd McHenry > > > > Van's Air Force > > > > Western Canada Wing > > > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Wing mailing list > > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wing mailing list > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tlc2 at telusplanet.net Wed Mar 6 01:40:48 2002 From: tlc2 at telusplanet.net (Tim) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] [Fwd: [RV Satisfaction] Message-ID: <3C85E420.FA888891@telusplanet.net> Thought some might be interested in Craig's comparison is interesting as he has owned/built both a -4 -8 of different horsepowers and (I think) objectively compares.......Below> Tim C Cold Lake -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: "Craig Hiers" Subject: Re: [RV-4] Satisfaction Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:41:19 -0500 Size: 10933 Url: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020306/43399a20/attachment.eml From wjoke at shaw.ca Wed Mar 6 05:55:46 2002 From: wjoke at shaw.ca (Jim Oke) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:16 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: <3C85AA12.84224EEC@telus.net> Message-ID: <001f01c1c516$9e68b860$6401a8c0@cd708596a> I'm not likely to be at Langley on 8 June, but if I was I would like to see Van's RV-9 demo aircraft. I'm building an RV-6A - so I don't think I'm biased on this ! Cheers, Jim Oke Wpg., MB RV-3 C-FIZM - flies occasionally RV-6A C-???? - heavy tinkering going on. > > > On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, Tedd McHenry wrote: > > > > > > > As you probably know, Van's is sending a rep to the Langley RV > > > Fly-in (June 8). > > > > We don't yet know which airplane they'll bring, and indeed they > > > don't yet know > > > > themselves. I can't guarantee they'll bring what we ask for, > > > but I thought I'd > > > > survey the members to see which factory RV you'd most like to > > > see, and forward > > > > the result to Van's. > > > > > > > > If you don't expect to attend, please don't reply. But if you do, and > > > > especially if you're still making up your mind which plane to > > > build, please let > > > > me know which one you'd most like to see. So far as I know, > > > the options are: > > > > -7, -8, -9A, and maybe -9. > > > > > > > > No, the -10 won't be ready! > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > > > > Tedd McHenry > > > > Van's Air Force > > > > Western Canada Wing > > > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Wing mailing list > > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wing mailing list > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Mar 6 11:00:27 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in In-Reply-To: <3C85AA12.84224EEC@telus.net> Message-ID: Okay, the introduction of the RV-9 has muddied the waters somewhat. Initially, the -7 had a strong lead in the poll. But the recently "leaked" news of the -9 spawned a flurry of interest. The -9 and -9A together have garnered 6 votes--three each--to the -7's 5. By my count, that still puts the -7 ahead, since we're counting individual airplanes here, not basic types. Any -9A supporters want to change their vote to the -9? Any new votes? --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From ham at hammcc.com Wed Mar 6 14:52:50 2002 From: ham at hammcc.com (Hamilton McClymont) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in In-Reply-To: Message-ID: 9 Hammy 604-241-2480 414-302-6650 (til March 15) http://www.hammcc.com > -----Original Message----- > From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On > Behalf Of Tedd McHenry > Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2002 11:00 AM > To: wing@vansairforce.org > Subject: Re: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in > > > Okay, the introduction of the RV-9 has muddied the waters > somewhat. Initially, > the -7 had a strong lead in the poll. But the recently "leaked" > news of the -9 > spawned a flurry of interest. The -9 and -9A together have garnered 6 > votes--three each--to the -7's 5. By my count, that still puts > the -7 ahead, > since we're counting individual airplanes here, not basic types. Any -9A > supporters want to change their vote to the -9? Any new votes? > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From 2w at telus.net Wed Mar 6 19:11:42 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (Bill Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <000001c1c587$80ea9a80$cf20b38e@bc.hsia.telus.net> Yes, I would like to see either a 9A or a 9, haven't seen one yet. The 7 is old news it has been around for a year already. Bill Robson RV-6 From acornyn at telusplanet.net Thu Mar 7 20:36:22 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers References: <000f01c1c46b$9ea765c0$8fe994d1@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <005001c1c65a$f823b310$fa1cb8a1@USER> In Pincher Creek, you can buy a 40 by 40 foot hanger for less than $10,000. and the annual lease is about $300. Eat your hearts out. Al ---- Original Message ----- From: "Norman" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 10:31 AM Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers > Could some one please pass on the dimensions of one of the T-hangers at > Langley BC? I'm researching buying one soon to clear up room to finish my > project. I have moved and managed to aquire another hot rod, need storage > space. Are the T-hangers big enough for cars/boats? I talked to the airport > manager and he said the hangers are supposed to be for aircraft only but he > generally looks the other way. > > Some basic research on hangers has turned me off my favorite airport: > Boundary Bay. It's half the drive than Langley for me and comes equipped > with customs but their prices are way too high. I was quoted $44,000 for a > 30 year lease on a brand new T-hanger with power, water, and phone. > Operating costs including property tax would be an additional $2000 a year. > > So far I've been told it's around $25,000 for a used T-hanger at Langley > with annual maintenance fees much less. Can anyone elaborate for me? Actual > costs and dimensions please? Power and water? > > Thank-you, > Norman Hunger > RV6A Delta BC > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tlc2 at telusplanet.net Fri Mar 8 03:11:26 2002 From: tlc2 at telusplanet.net (Tim) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers References: <000f01c1c46b$9ea765c0$8fe994d1@oemcomputer> <005001c1c65a$f823b310$fa1cb8a1@USER> Message-ID: <3C889C5D.E5B4141D@telusplanet.net> Hey, Al.......> I'm just North of 'Ya'..... not in, but at ;-)....Cold Lake, AB 'EN5'......10K, Hanger "eh?"...Bet the bottom line in puppy doesn't include>.......a Radient heater..$1.5K to $2K.....Natural Gas Hook-up $2200.00 [Yes big bucks just to have a meter and to play]........Radient Heater Hardware $1500 to $1800 not installed, which doesn't include outside piping rigging. How about some windows on the Soutern Exsposure?...Or a Bifold manual/powered Door $2K - $6.5K.....Oh well, live and learn.........I'm starting on my #2, Hanger, again being constructed by myself, on our recently purchased 1/4 section -160 acreas just off of Base (Aairforce Spouse)......This Hanger from hell, will be a 50'x40' ( got the 50' span trusses Cheap ;-)....but with a 14'x40' Lean Too/Shop (last one was 12x40' lean-too)....Bottom Line, like as in Homebuilts..... If you want to build it all yourself, you will save money $$$$, But loose vauleable time.....What a concept....Reminds me the first time, I rode with 'The Van Meister' in the prototype -6 (blue bird) at Oshkosh, 1986........Oh my...That's another Story ;-) Bottom Line> There is always a 'Cheaper' (less expensive) ways of doing things.....But in the ole battle of > Time vs Money.....Do you feel Lucky? Hey, do any of you Guy's know 'me brudder'... Dean Cramb? Pres..Duncan Flying Club/EAA Chap 679?.....Vancouver Island..."Oh how I miss the Coast" My true Being..... Tim Cramb EAA 369671 4 Wing Cold Lake, Alberta....No Spell check > In Pincher Creek, you can buy a 40 by 40 foot hanger for less than $10,000. > and the annual lease is about $300. Eat your hearts out. Al ---- Original > Message ----- > From: "Norman" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 10:31 AM > Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers > > > Could some one please pass on the dimensions of one of the T-hangers at > > Langley BC? I'm researching buying one soon to clear up room to finish my > > project. I have moved and managed to aquire another hot rod, need storage > > space. Are the T-hangers big enough for cars/boats? I talked to the > airport > > manager and he said the hangers are supposed to be for aircraft only but > he > > generally looks the other way. > > > > Some basic research on hangers has turned me off my favorite airport: > > Boundary Bay. It's half the drive than Langley for me and comes equipped > > with customs but their prices are way too high. I was quoted $44,000 for a > > 30 year lease on a brand new T-hanger with power, water, and phone. > > Operating costs including property tax would be an additional $2000 a > year. > > > > So far I've been told it's around $25,000 for a used T-hanger at Langley > > with annual maintenance fees much less. Can anyone elaborate for me? > Actual > > costs and dimensions please? Power and water? > > > > Thank-you, > > Norman Hunger > > RV6A Delta BC > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From acornyn at telusplanet.net Fri Mar 8 08:15:09 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers References: <000f01c1c46b$9ea765c0$8fe994d1@oemcomputer> <005001c1c65a$f823b310$fa1cb8a1@USER> <3C889C5D.E5B4141D@telusplanet.net> Message-ID: <000d01c1c6bc$cc1c90e0$ee1cb8a1@USER> Actually, it does have a 80,000 btu radiant heater and is both insulated and dry walled. The door is on rollers and slides around the inside. It doesn't take any ceiling space and doesn't care if the power is out and always works. Al ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim" To: Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 4:11 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] Langley Hangers > Hey, Al.......> > > I'm just North of 'Ya'..... not in, but at ;-)....Cold > Lake, AB 'EN5'......10K, Hanger "eh?"...Bet the bottom line in puppy doesn't > include>.......a Radient heater..$1.5K to $2K.....Natural Gas Hook-up $2200.00 > [Yes big bucks just to have a meter and to play]........Radient Heater Hardware > $1500 to $1800 not installed, which doesn't include outside piping rigging. How > about some windows on the Soutern Exsposure?...Or a Bifold manual/powered Door > $2K - $6.5K.....Oh well, live and learn.........I'm starting on my #2, Hanger, > again being constructed by myself, on our recently purchased 1/4 section -160 > acreas just off of Base (Aairforce Spouse)......This Hanger from hell, will be a > 50'x40' ( got the 50' span trusses Cheap ;-)....but with a 14'x40' Lean Too/Shop > (last one was 12x40' lean-too)....Bottom Line, like as in Homebuilts..... If you > want to build it all yourself, you will save money $$$$, But loose vauleable > time.....What a concept....Reminds me the first time, I rode with 'The Van > Meister' in the prototype -6 (blue bird) at Oshkosh, 1986........Oh my...That's > another Story ;-) > > Bottom Line> There is always a 'Cheaper' (less expensive) ways of doing > things.....But in the ole battle of > Time vs Money.....Do you feel Lucky? > > Hey, do any of you Guy's know 'me brudder'... Dean Cramb? Pres..Duncan Flying > Club/EAA Chap 679?.....Vancouver Island..."Oh how I miss the Coast" My true > Being..... > > Tim Cramb > EAA 369671 > 4 Wing Cold Lake, Alberta....No Spell check > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Pincher Creek, you can buy a 40 by 40 foot hanger for less than $10,000. > > and the annual lease is about $300. Eat your hearts out. Al ---- Original > > Message ----- > > From: "Norman" > > To: > > Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 10:31 AM > > Subject: [Wing] Langley Hangers > > > > > Could some one please pass on the dimensions of one of the T-hangers at > > > Langley BC? I'm researching buying one soon to clear up room to finish my > > > project. I have moved and managed to aquire another hot rod, need storage > > > space. Are the T-hangers big enough for cars/boats? I talked to the > > airport > > > manager and he said the hangers are supposed to be for aircraft only but > > he > > > generally looks the other way. > > > > > > Some basic research on hangers has turned me off my favorite airport: > > > Boundary Bay. It's half the drive than Langley for me and comes equipped > > > with customs but their prices are way too high. I was quoted $44,000 for a > > > 30 year lease on a brand new T-hanger with power, water, and phone. > > > Operating costs including property tax would be an additional $2000 a > > year. > > > > > > So far I've been told it's around $25,000 for a used T-hanger at Langley > > > with annual maintenance fees much less. Can anyone elaborate for me? > > Actual > > > costs and dimensions please? Power and water? > > > > > > Thank-you, > > > Norman Hunger > > > RV6A Delta BC > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wing mailing list > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From rtaylor at telus.net Fri Mar 8 23:06:10 2002 From: rtaylor at telus.net (Roy Taylor) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <3C89B462.21322B1A@telus.net> 9 Roy Taylor Hamilton McClymont wrote: > 9 > > Hammy > > 604-241-2480 > 414-302-6650 (til March 15) > http://www.hammcc.com > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On > > Behalf Of Tedd McHenry > > Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2002 11:00 AM > > To: wing@vansairforce.org > > Subject: Re: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in > > > > > > Okay, the introduction of the RV-9 has muddied the waters > > somewhat. Initially, > > the -7 had a strong lead in the poll. But the recently "leaked" > > news of the -9 > > spawned a flurry of interest. The -9 and -9A together have garnered 6 > > votes--three each--to the -7's 5. By my count, that still puts > > the -7 ahead, > > since we're counting individual airplanes here, not basic types. Any -9A > > supporters want to change their vote to the -9? Any new votes? > > > > --- > > > > Tedd McHenry > > Van's Air Force > > Western Canada Wing > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca Mon Mar 11 16:02:30 2002 From: Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca (Bob_Cutting@toyota.ca) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Building an RV9A Message-ID: I,m building an RV9A with an 0-290-D2A (140HP) and electronic ignition, there are some unique changes needed to install this engine, and although Vans advertises the RV9 as good for the 0235/0290/0320, they only offer support for the 0320.. there are a lot of parts which dont fit, like the baffles and the carb heat box, however, it can be done as I have already engineered some changes. I would be very interested in sharing with anyone else contemplating the 9A with either the 235 or the 290......... I can be reached at (604) 275-1603 or 278-6211#311 From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Mar 12 08:08:05 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in In-Reply-To: Message-ID: In our poll to determine the preferred RV for Van's to bring to the Langley fly-in, the new RV-9, since it's announcement, has gone from nothing to the leading choice. Here's how the votes break down so far. -7 5 -8 0 (1 second choice) -9 7 -9A 3 Coincidentally, Wing member Bob Cutting was speaking to Gus Funnell, of Van's last week, and Gus asked him which airplane he thought they should send. Bob told the the thought the new -9 would be the best choice. I'll also send the same message to Van's. Thanks to everyone who participated in the poll. Which airplane they bring also depends, of course, on Van's schedule, and serviceability of the airplane. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca Wed Mar 13 08:03:24 2002 From: Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca (Bob_Cutting@toyota.ca) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in Message-ID: When you say -9, I assume you mean the 9A....Ididnt know that Vans had a tail wheel version flying From ltodd at telus.net Wed Mar 13 08:49:52 2002 From: ltodd at telus.net (Linda Todd) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Building an RV9A References: Message-ID: <000d01c1caaf$19cae760$94e335d1@oemcomputer> Interesting that they only support the 0-320. Didn't they originally advertise it as being perfect for the 0-235 118 HP ? ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 4:02 PM Subject: [Wing] Building an RV9A > I,m building an RV9A with an 0-290-D2A (140HP) and electronic ignition, > there are some unique changes needed to install this engine, and although > Vans advertises the RV9 as good for the 0235/0290/0320, they only offer > support for the 0320.. there are a lot of parts which dont fit, like the > baffles and the carb heat box, however, it can be done as I have already > engineered some changes. I would be very interested in sharing with anyone > else contemplating the 9A with either the 235 or the 290......... I can be > reached at (604) 275-1603 or 278-6211#311 > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From ltodd at telus.net Wed Mar 13 08:54:38 2002 From: ltodd at telus.net (Linda Todd) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <002101c1caaf$c4957020$94e335d1@oemcomputer> It's beautiful and you can see a picture of it in flight (minus its gear leg fairings) on Van's web site. Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2002 8:03 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in > > When you say -9, I assume you mean the 9A....Ididnt know that Vans had a > tail wheel version flying > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From rv7 at b4.ca Wed Mar 13 09:50:14 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Van's at Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <3C8F9156.90301@b4.ca> Yeppers... It was only a matter of time before they made one with the third wheel in the right place... 8-) http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/rv9_firstflight.htm -RB4 Bob_Cutting@toyota.ca wrote: >When you say -9, I assume you mean the 9A....Ididnt know that Vans had a >tail wheel version flying > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon Mar 25 14:34:06 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program Message-ID: Many of you probably already know that Van's Aircraft has an insurance program with Nation Air--the VanGuard program--to provide discounted insurance to RV owners. I've checked with Nation Air and, unfortunately, this program is not available to RV owners in Canada. The representative from Nation Air, John Helms, recommended that RV owners in Canada contact AIG (American International Group). This was his personal recommendation, and should not be regarded as a recommendation from me, Van's, or anybody else. But if you do find out something from AIG, perhaps you could pass it on to the Wing. Tedd McHenry From ham at hammcc.com Mon Mar 25 15:11:02 2002 From: ham at hammcc.com (Hamilton McClymont) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Everyone will be aware, no doubt, that Avemco is getting out of the business of insuring fast homebuilts, RV's included. Avweb and Aero News both had stories this morning describing how the EAA Pres is trying to get Avemco to rethink their decision. Hammy To: Western Canada Wing List Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program Many of you probably already know that Van's Aircraft has an insurance program with Nation Air--the VanGuard program--to provide discounted insurance to RV owners. I've checked with Nation Air and, unfortunately, this program is not available to RV owners in Canada. The representative from Nation Air, John Helms, recommended that RV owners in Canada contact AIG (American International Group). This was his personal recommendation, and should not be regarded as a recommendation from me, Van's, or anybody else. But if you do find out something from AIG, perhaps you could pass it on to the Wing. Tedd McHenry From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Mon Mar 25 16:51:43 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program References: Message-ID: <002901c1d460$66da0e40$ca1cb8a1@murray> Marsh Canada with COPA is very happy to insure RV's in Canada. My last policy was $1705 for the Gold Package. Avemco was quite a bit higher and not as easy to deal with. Doug M. C-GRPA RV-6 ----- Original Message ----- From: Tedd McHenry To: Western Canada Wing List Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 3:34 PM Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > Many of you probably already know that Van's Aircraft has an insurance program > with Nation Air--the VanGuard program--to provide discounted insurance to RV > owners. I've checked with Nation Air and, unfortunately, this program is not > available to RV owners in Canada. > > The representative from Nation Air, John Helms, recommended that RV owners in > Canada contact AIG (American International Group). This was his personal > recommendation, and should not be regarded as a recommendation from me, Van's, > or anybody else. But if you do find out something from AIG, perhaps you could > pass it on to the Wing. > > Tedd McHenry > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From acornyn at telusplanet.net Tue Mar 26 06:52:03 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sport Aviation Message-ID: <000a01c1d4d5$cbdac800$a01cb8a1@USER> My baby is on page 81 of the latest Sport Aviation Mag. Al -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020326/c131b9a1/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Mar 26 07:28:58 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sport Aviation In-Reply-To: <000a01c1d4d5$cbdac800$a01cb8a1@USER> Message-ID: > My baby is on page 81 of the latest Sport Aviation Mag. > Al I noticed that last night when I got my copy, Al. Nice going. The plane looks great. Cute message on the flaps, too. Tedd McHenry Surrey, BC From ltodd at telus.net Wed Mar 27 12:49:09 2002 From: ltodd at telus.net (Linda Todd) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program References: <002901c1d460$66da0e40$ca1cb8a1@murray> Message-ID: <001701c1d5d0$d93927c0$7be335d1@oemcomputer> The trouble with the COPA insurance is that is is only "not in motion". So you wouldn't be covered for a bird strike or taxiing accident etc. We had good experience insuring the RV with Avemco for "in flight" but are now getting quotes from other insurers. If anyone has a suggestion for a good insurer I'd like to know. Thanks. BTW has anyone talked to Avemco Canada? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douglas G. Murray" To: Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 4:51 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > Marsh Canada with COPA is very happy to insure RV's in Canada. My last > policy was $1705 for the Gold Package. Avemco was quite a bit higher and > not as easy to deal with. > > Doug M. C-GRPA RV-6 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tedd McHenry > To: Western Canada Wing List > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 3:34 PM > Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > > > > Many of you probably already know that Van's Aircraft has an insurance > program > > with Nation Air--the VanGuard program--to provide discounted insurance to > RV > > owners. I've checked with Nation Air and, unfortunately, this program is > not > > available to RV owners in Canada. > > > > The representative from Nation Air, John Helms, recommended that RV owners > in > > Canada contact AIG (American International Group). This was his personal > > recommendation, and should not be regarded as a recommendation from me, > Van's, > > or anybody else. But if you do find out something from AIG, perhaps you > could > > pass it on to the Wing. > > > > Tedd McHenry > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Wed Mar 27 21:26:53 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program References: <002901c1d460$66da0e40$ca1cb8a1@murray> <001701c1d5d0$d93927c0$7be335d1@oemcomputer> Message-ID: <001101c1d619$2c786a20$9d1cb8a1@dgmurray> Linda - Copa insurance is from Marsh Canada and DOES cover bird strike and any other accident on the ground OR while flying in the air. You must ask for the GOLD wings program to get the additional coverage. I did talk to Avemco in Canada and was quoted real high prices for ground coverage only including taxi. I have seen that this past week the EAA has written that Avemco is refusing to insure RV, Lancair, Glasair and sereal more higher performance homebuilts. Doug M. C-GRPA ----- Original Message ----- From: Linda Todd To: Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 1:49 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > The trouble with the COPA insurance is that is is only "not in motion". So > you wouldn't be covered for a bird strike or taxiing accident etc. We had > good experience insuring the RV with Avemco for "in flight" but are now > getting quotes from other insurers. If anyone has a suggestion for a good > insurer I'd like to know. Thanks. > BTW has anyone talked to Avemco Canada? > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Douglas G. Murray" > To: > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 4:51 PM > Subject: Re: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > > > > Marsh Canada with COPA is very happy to insure RV's in Canada. My last > > policy was $1705 for the Gold Package. Avemco was quite a bit higher and > > not as easy to deal with. > > > > Doug M. C-GRPA RV-6 > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Tedd McHenry > > To: Western Canada Wing List > > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 3:34 PM > > Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > > > > > > > Many of you probably already know that Van's Aircraft has an insurance > > program > > > with Nation Air--the VanGuard program--to provide discounted insurance > to > > RV > > > owners. I've checked with Nation Air and, unfortunately, this program > is > > not > > > available to RV owners in Canada. > > > > > > The representative from Nation Air, John Helms, recommended that RV > owners > > in > > > Canada contact AIG (American International Group). This was his > personal > > > recommendation, and should not be regarded as a recommendation from me, > > Van's, > > > or anybody else. But if you do find out something from AIG, perhaps you > > could > > > pass it on to the Wing. > > > > > > Tedd McHenry > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wing mailing list > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tlc2 at telusplanet.net Wed Mar 27 22:55:05 2002 From: tlc2 at telusplanet.net (Tim) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program References: <002901c1d460$66da0e40$ca1cb8a1@murray> <001701c1d5d0$d93927c0$7be335d1@oemcomputer> <001101c1d619$2c786a20$9d1cb8a1@dgmurray> Message-ID: <3CA2BE48.DC1672E0@telusplanet.net> A friend here in Cold Lake had his Pitts dropped by Avemco....He was also told his F1 Rocket was "Out of the Box/Envelope" ;-) Avemco Business Plan> More for Less = Higher premiums @ Lower Risk......."Piss-on-em" Tim Cramb Cold Lake, AB Douglas G. Murray wrote: > Linda - > > Copa insurance is from Marsh Canada and DOES cover bird strike and any other > accident on the ground OR while flying in the air. You must ask for the GOLD > wings program to get the additional coverage. > > I did talk to Avemco in Canada and was quoted real high prices for ground > coverage only including taxi. I have seen that this past week the EAA has > written that Avemco is refusing to insure RV, Lancair, Glasair and sereal > more higher performance homebuilts. > > Doug M. > C-GRPA > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Linda Todd > To: > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 1:49 PM > Subject: Re: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > > > The trouble with the COPA insurance is that is is only "not in motion". So > > you wouldn't be covered for a bird strike or taxiing accident etc. We had > > good experience insuring the RV with Avemco for "in flight" but are now > > getting quotes from other insurers. If anyone has a suggestion for a good > > insurer I'd like to know. Thanks. > > BTW has anyone talked to Avemco Canada? > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Douglas G. Murray" > > To: > > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 4:51 PM > > Subject: Re: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > > > > > > > Marsh Canada with COPA is very happy to insure RV's in Canada. My last > > > policy was $1705 for the Gold Package. Avemco was quite a bit higher > and > > > not as easy to deal with. > > > > > > Doug M. C-GRPA RV-6 > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: Tedd McHenry > > > To: Western Canada Wing List > > > Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 3:34 PM > > > Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program > > > > > > > > > > Many of you probably already know that Van's Aircraft has an insurance > > > program > > > > with Nation Air--the VanGuard program--to provide discounted insurance > > to > > > RV > > > > owners. I've checked with Nation Air and, unfortunately, this program > > is > > > not > > > > available to RV owners in Canada. > > > > > > > > The representative from Nation Air, John Helms, recommended that RV > > owners > > > in > > > > Canada contact AIG (American International Group). This was his > > personal > > > > recommendation, and should not be regarded as a recommendation from > me, > > > Van's, > > > > or anybody else. But if you do find out something from AIG, perhaps > you > > > could > > > > pass it on to the Wing. > > > > > > > > Tedd McHenry > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Wing mailing list > > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wing mailing list > > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tlc2 at telusplanet.net Wed Mar 27 23:08:00 2002 From: tlc2 at telusplanet.net (Tim) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Insurance Update> Avemco Blinks Message-ID: <3CA2C150.6E7E46D5@telusplanet.net> ON THE FLY... EAA posted an update on Avemco insurance at ... Tim C Cold Lake From ltodd at telus.net Thu Mar 28 06:42:28 2002 From: ltodd at telus.net (Linda Todd) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program References: <002901c1d460$66da0e40$ca1cb8a1@murray> <001701c1d5d0$d93927c0$7be335d1@oemcomputer> <001101c1d619$2c786a20$9d1cb8a1@dgmurray> Message-ID: <000e01c1d666$e277e100$3de335d1@oemcomputer> Doug, Thanks for the info on the Gold wings - guess I was reading it wrong in their literature. Think we'll give them a call. Linda From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Mar 28 12:44:19 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] George McNutt Photos Message-ID: Wing member George McNutt, of Langley, BC, has recently posted to the Wing Photo Archive some really terrific pictures of his RV-6 project. You can see them at http://www.vansairforce.org/photos --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From rv7 at b4.ca Mon Apr 1 08:58:33 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] [Fwd: RV-List: Crack found in part] Message-ID: <3CA891B9.5000108@b4.ca> Those of us still building may want to check our parts... This came from the RV-List. -RB4 -------- Original Message -------- Purchasers of part VAF-MU-G from Vans Aircraft are warned that cracks have been found in the handle of one item. It is suggested that, although the part is designed to hold liquids up to 100C, the part failure may be due to inappropriate use of automated cleansing mechanisms where high temperatures and caustic chemicals may have damaged the component. Alternatively, the part may have been mishandled and consequently overstressed. Vans Aircraft cannot comment further since the failed part has not yet been returned to Vans Aircraft for analysis. Concerned builders should NOT contact Vans Aircraft regarding this... Vans will notify builders if any remedial action is needed. Builders are cautioned NOT to incorporate the part into an aircraft. It is also suggested that the part not be used whilst airborne, and under no circumstances should it be used during aerobatics. Given that the part is designed to contain hot liquids, builders are warned that failure of the part may result in facial burns or other injuries. Further, an immediate visual inspection of the part should be undertaken. The failed part was cracked at the bottom of the handle. Magnafluxing is not considered necessary. Vans has stress-tested samples to 150% of the design load. Vanz will re-test selected samples to ensure that currently supplied parts are still up to standard. It is stressed that there is no failure of the ceramic coating of the part, so that there is no danger of leakage. FAA spokesman Loof Lipra declined to comment, saying that this part was outside the jurisdiction of the FAA. The NTSB are said to be concerned, but since no actual incident has occurred, will not be pursuing the matter. From m.speer at shaw.ca Mon Apr 1 11:15:50 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] [Fwd: RV-List: Crack found in part] References: <3CA891B9.5000108@b4.ca> Message-ID: <3CA8B1E6.75EB0EDD@shaw.ca> Excellent sleuthing RB4, keep on top of this problem and have report available for our perusal 04/01/03 ..scramies Rob Prior wrote: > Those of us still building may want to check our parts... This came from > the RV-List. > > -RB4 > > -------- Original Message -------- > > Purchasers of part VAF-MU-G from Vans Aircraft are warned that cracks have > been found in the handle of one item. > > It is suggested that, although the part is designed to hold liquids up to > 100C, the part failure may be due to inappropriate use of automated > cleansing mechanisms where high temperatures and caustic chemicals may have > damaged the component. Alternatively, the part may have been mishandled and > consequently overstressed. Vans Aircraft cannot comment further since the > failed part has not yet been returned to Vans Aircraft for analysis. > Concerned builders should NOT contact Vans Aircraft regarding this... Vans > will notify builders if any remedial action is needed. > > Builders are cautioned NOT to incorporate the part into an aircraft. It is > also suggested that the part not be used whilst airborne, and under no > circumstances should it be used during aerobatics. Given that the part is > designed to contain hot liquids, builders are warned that failure of the > part may result in facial burns or other injuries. > > Further, an immediate visual inspection of the part should be undertaken. > The failed part was cracked at the bottom of the handle. Magnafluxing is > not considered necessary. Vans has stress-tested samples to 150% of the > design load. Vanz will re-test selected samples to ensure that currently > supplied parts are still up to standard. It is stressed that there is no > failure of the ceramic coating of the part, so that there is no danger of > leakage. > > FAA spokesman Loof Lipra declined to comment, saying that this part was > outside the jurisdiction of the FAA. The NTSB are said to be concerned, but > since no actual incident has occurred, will not be pursuing the matter. > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon Apr 1 13:27:52 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] [Fwd: RV-List: Crack found in part] In-Reply-To: <3CA891B9.5000108@b4.ca> Message-ID: > under no > circumstances should it be used during aerobatics. Many pilots would find it impossible to perform aerobatics without this critical dietary supplement. Tedd From Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca Mon Apr 1 08:47:34 2002 From: Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca (Bob_Cutting@toyota.ca) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] VanGuard Insurance Program Message-ID: I had my RV6A insured with Avemco for 2000 and 2001, to my shock, when I recieved my renewal notice for 2002, the rate had doubled and I was told that ALL aircraft insurance rates had gone through the roof as a result of Sept 11th, I was also told that they are ne longer insuring homebuilts, then I sold my RV6A and phoned to cancel the policy and was given a cancellation penalty!!.......needless to say, I wont be using or recommending AVEMCO From Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca Mon Apr 1 09:24:43 2002 From: Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca (Bob_Cutting@toyota.ca) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] [Fwd: RV-List: Crack found in part] Message-ID: OK, you got me, what part is it?? From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Apr 11 16:04:26 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Importing Experimental Aircraft from the USA Message-ID: This is good news for those of you who are thinking of buying an RV. It might be bad news for those who are selling except that most Canadian RVs are sold in the USA anyway. This was obtained for us by Terry Elgood, the chief MDRA inspector for BC (I thinik). Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 11 Apr 2002 17:20:37 -0600 Subject: Importing Experimental Aircraft from the USA Sir, The revised standards, governing the design and construction of amateur-built aircraft in Canada, that have been accepted by the CARAC Part V Technical Committee, will provide for the importation of foreign-built, foreign-registered amateur-built aircraft that have a minimum of 100 hours air time. Under the future rules, this aircraft will be eligible for a Special Certificate of Airworthiness - Amateur-built, following an inspection by either Transport Canada or MD-RA Inspection Services Inc. Importing this aircraft at this time does involve a risk, albeit a minimal risk. Please contact me in a month or so and I will inform you about the status of the exemption. Transport Canada has prepared a global ministerial exemption that will provide for the implementation of the "new" rules in the near future. Considering that this particular aircraft is in need of repairs, it will not be eligible for a Canadian flight authority in the very near future. By the time it is ready to fly, the "rules" should be in place. Please contact the Canada Custom Agency for information regarding the importation of the aircraft, paperwork to be provided, taxes to be paid, etc.. Please ensure that you get a bill of sales (it will be required to move it across the US-Canada border and to register the aircraft in Canada). Please make sure that you get the complete technical records for the aircraft. You will be asked to prove that the aircraft has the required air time. Photocopies are acceptable provided that a "certified true copy" declaration accompanies the photocopied documents, along with an explanation as to why the original documents are not being provided by the present (foreign) owner. Notwithstanding, originals are always the preferred choice. Once you have completed the repairs, and are ready for the inspection, please contact MD-RA Inspection Services at 1-877-419-2111. Maurice A. Simoneau Recreational Aircraft / A?ronefs de loisir [AARPG] Aircraft Maintenance and Manufacturing / Maintenance et construction des a?ronefs Transport Canada Civil Aviation / Transports Canada Aviation civile tel: 1-613-990-9490 fax: 1-613-952-3298 simonem@tc.gc.ca -----Original Message----- From: John Wiebe [mailto:wiebe_john@hotmail.com] Sent: April 5, 2002 10:25 To: simonem@tc.gc.ca Subject: Imoprting RV-6 Hi Maurice, As discussed yesterday by phone, The aircraft that I wish to import is an RV-6. It was constructed from a standard kit from Vans aircraft Co. by Donald L. Piermattei DVM, PhD, 5000 E. Country Rd 92, Carr, Colorado 80612. At a total time of 185 hours it was damaged in a landing accident at Mr. Piermattei's base (FNL)on return from OSH last summer due to engine failure. The landing gear,both wing tips, and cowling were damaged. The serial # is 22913. The airworthiness certificate was received May 2, 1998 and the registration was N192DP.It is now deregistered with the FAA. In your authorization letter, or as an attachment, can you also indicate for my future reference to the MD-RA what the inspection process requirement will be? Thank you for your help. Sincerely, John Wiebe Box 1515 Humboldt, Sask S0K 2A0 Ph:(306)682-5844 Day:(306)682-1742 Fax:(306)682-1743 _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Apr 13 07:46:07 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] RAA Forum Message-ID: Not to detract from this email group, but the RAA Forum email group has several MD-RA inspectors on it, and is a very good place to ask questions related to inspections and the inspecction process. You can join that email group at http://www.raa.ca/mailman/listinfo/forum Since I'm the administrator for both groups, I'll keep an eye out for interesting messages on each and cross-post them to the other. That way people on this list who don't want to join another list will still see important information that gets discussed on the RAA Forum. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From rv7 at b4.ca Sat Apr 13 09:58:03 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] RAA Forum References: Message-ID: <3CB8639B.5000707@b4.ca> Before you all jump in and register, please keep in mind that the RAA forum is for National members of RAAC only. All others will be removed from the subscriber's list. -Rob Prior Director, BC Mainland, RAAC Director, RAA Chapter 85 Builder, RV-7 Empennage Tedd McHenry wrote: >Not to detract from this email group, but the RAA Forum email group has several >MD-RA inspectors on it, and is a very good place to ask questions related to >inspections and the inspecction process. You can join that email group at > > http://www.raa.ca/mailman/listinfo/forum > >Since I'm the administrator for both groups, I'll keep an eye out for >interesting messages on each and cross-post them to the other. That way people >on this list who don't want to join another list will still see important >information that gets discussed on the RAA Forum. > >--- > >Tedd McHenry >Van's Air Force >Western Canada Wing >tedd@vansairforce.org >www.vansairforce.org > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > -- --------- Rob Prior rv7 "at" b4.ca ----------------------------- Stop dreaming... Start flying From gmcnutt at intergate.ca Sat Apr 13 12:08:55 2002 From: gmcnutt at intergate.ca (George McNutt) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV's & Max Gross Weight In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I am meeting some resistance from the MD-RA about increasing the gross weight of my RV-6A above Vans "recommended" 1650 lb, this despite the wording in the builders manual that the builder can set his own gross weight. Another RV-6A parked a few feet from mine had no problems with a 1700 lb weight. MD-RA want a letter from Vans approving increase, Gus at Van's says "we don't write individual letters". I would be interested in hearing from any Canadian builders who has a higher than "recommended" gross weight and how it was accomplished. E-mail me direct gmcnutt@intergate.ca Thanks George McNutt Langley B.C. First flight when I get paperwork! From ve7fp at jetstream.net Sat Apr 13 18:36:40 2002 From: ve7fp at jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV's & Max Gross Weight References: Message-ID: <00af01c1e357$721938c0$aebb17cf@kenhoshowski> George I know of one builder who has a 1800 lb.gross. My understanding is that he did a wing loading calculation, sorry I don't know the formula,( I believe it is available from Transport Canada) and it worked out that he could register it at 1800 lbs. I too, wanted to increase my gross and talked to Bill Benedict ( this goes back a few years ) and they would not budge from the 1600 lb. figure. You mention it is now 1650 lbs which is a slight improvement over mine. I don't want to mention this builders name but I think he is a list member and hopefully might respond. Look forward to seeing your project at the Langley fly in. Ken Hoshowski RV6 C-FKEH First flight Sept. 8, 1993 ----- Original Message ----- From: "George McNutt" To: Sent: Saturday, April 13, 2002 12:08 PM Subject: [Wing] RV's & Max Gross Weight > > > I am meeting some resistance from the MD-RA about increasing the gross > weight of my RV-6A above Vans "recommended" 1650 lb, this despite the > wording in the builders manual that the builder can set his own gross > weight. > > Another RV-6A parked a few feet from mine had no problems with a 1700 lb > weight. > > MD-RA want a letter from Vans approving increase, Gus at Van's says "we > don't write individual letters". > > I would be interested in hearing from any Canadian builders who has a higher > than "recommended" gross weight and how it was accomplished. E-mail me > direct gmcnutt@intergate.ca > > Thanks > > George McNutt > Langley B.C. > First flight when I get paperwork! > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From gmcnutt at intergate.ca Sat Apr 13 19:42:54 2002 From: gmcnutt at intergate.ca (George McNutt) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV's & Max Gross Weight In-Reply-To: <00af01c1e357$721938c0$aebb17cf@kenhoshowski> Message-ID: Subject: Re: [Wing] RV's & Max Gross Weight George I know of one builder who has a 1800 lb.gross. My understanding is that he did a wing loading calculation, sorry I don't know the formula,( I believe it is available from Transport Canada) and it worked out that he could register it at 1800 lbs. I too, wanted to increase my gross and talked to Bill Benedict ( this goes back a few years ) and they would not budge from the 1600 lb. figure. You mention it is now 1650 lbs which is a slight improvement over mine. I don't want to mention this builders name but I think he is a list member and hopefully might respond. Look forward to seeing your project at the Langley fly in. Ken Hoshowski RV6 C-FKEH First flight Sept. 8, 1993 HI Ken In the application paperwork for a Special CofA for amateur-built aircraft there is a calculation A549.1 (Appendix A) that you are required to do to work out a maximum wing loading per sq/ft. This is based on Flap Span Ratio, Flap Chord and Deflection. When you go through this excercise and get a max wt per sq/ft and when multiply by the wing area it gives a Maximum Allowable Take-off Mass (weight) of 1810 pounds for our RV-6/6A. This is a political weight number, any weight above this and the aircraft becomes a high performance aircraft and the pilot requires a high performance rating. The RV-6 & 6A are structurally identical (except gear) but Van's recommend 1600 lb max for RV6 and 1650 lb for 6A, keeping the weight low improves the sales brochure performance figures. About Van's giving approval for a weight increase, apparently it depends on who you talk to at Van's, a MD-RA person in Toronto said that they have lots of letters from Van's on file. I am applying for a weight of 1750 lbs and surprisingly there is absolutely nothing I can find in the regulations (CAR 549) about strength or "G" loading for amateur-built aircraft. Hangar # 20, West side, Langley - see you June 8th. George McNutt C-GJTY From patman at itdoesntsuck.com Sat Apr 13 20:07:59 2002 From: patman at itdoesntsuck.com (Pat Dayman) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Accepting reality In-Reply-To: References: <00af01c1e357$721938c0$aebb17cf@kenhoshowski> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.1.20020413230514.00b47860@mail.earthlink.net> Unfortunately, reality has set in. I have a Fiancee, (and now a 7 year old) and it is time to buy a house. Much to my disapointment, I must sell my RV-4 CF-JOJ. If anyone knows of anyone interested in a complete RV-4 with 500hrs TT and 325 on the engine, please give them my e-mail address. Thanks Pat Dayman patman@itdoesntsuck.com (703) 628-0254 From tedd at vansairforce.org Sun Apr 14 06:51:29 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Accepting reality In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.1.20020413230514.00b47860@mail.earthlink.net> Message-ID: If you're interested in Pat's RV-4, you can see pictures of it on the Wing web site at http://www.vansairforce.org/airplanes/C-FJOJ Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org On Sat, 13 Apr 2002, Pat Dayman wrote: > > Unfortunately, reality has set in. I have a Fiancee, (and now a 7 year old) > and it is time to buy a house. Much to my disapointment, I must sell my > RV-4 CF-JOJ. If anyone knows of anyone interested in a complete RV-4 with > 500hrs TT and 325 on the engine, please give them my e-mail address. > > Thanks > > Pat Dayman > > patman@itdoesntsuck.com > > (703) 628-0254 From patman at itdoesntsuck.com Sun Apr 14 07:20:51 2002 From: patman at itdoesntsuck.com (Pat Dayman) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Accepting reality In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.1.20020413230514.00b47860@mail.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.1.20020414102035.00b4a310@mail.earthlink.net> Thanks Tedd. At 06:51 AM 4/14/2002 -0700, you wrote: >If you're interested in Pat's RV-4, you can see pictures of it on the Wing web >site at > > http://www.vansairforce.org/airplanes/C-FJOJ > >Tedd McHenry >Van's Air Force >Western Canada Wing >tedd@vansairforce.org >www.vansairforce.org > >On Sat, 13 Apr 2002, Pat Dayman wrote: > > > > > Unfortunately, reality has set in. I have a Fiancee, (and now a 7 year > old) > > and it is time to buy a house. Much to my disapointment, I must sell my > > RV-4 CF-JOJ. If anyone knows of anyone interested in a complete RV-4 with > > 500hrs TT and 325 on the engine, please give them my e-mail address. > > > > Thanks > > > > Pat Dayman > > > > patman@itdoesntsuck.com > > > > (703) 628-0254 > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon Apr 22 13:56:38 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] CYCW Restaurant - Hours? Message-ID: Does anybody know what the operating hours are for the restaurant at CYCW? I'm thinking of a dinner/pie run one evening this week. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Apr 26 13:20:12 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Mike Seager Training @ Langley Fly-in Message-ID: As you probably know, we have arranged flights with Mike Seager, the Van's-authorised RV transition training pilot, at the Langley RV Fly-in on June 8. However, bookings for flights with Mike have been far, far less than we anticipated. As a result, we may have to cancel the training. We need to get many more bookings before May 8 (i.e. one month in advance of the fly-in). If not, we can't justify Mike coming, as he is in great demand in the U.S. If you want a flight with Mike, please contact me at tedd@vansairforce.org. I'll put you in contact with Linda Todd, who is recording all the bookings. Mike will be doing transition training in his RV-6 (N66VA). You can read more about the transition training program at http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/trainfly.htm --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Sun Apr 28 13:58:27 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-in: U.S. Arrivals Message-ID: I've put together a web page that gives procedures for U.S. pilots flying to Canada. If you're planning to attend the Langley RV Fly-in on June 8 coming from the U.S., or make any other trip to Canada from the U.S, you may find it useful. You can link to the page from the fly-in main page (http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ) or you can go directly to the U.S. Procedures page at http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/us_arrive. The web page covers: o documentation you should carry in the airplane o ID and proof of citizenship o customs procedures (Canada and U.S.) o special requirements for Experimental aircraft o differences in Canadian flying regs and procedures We also have a discount rate at the nearby Travelodge hotel. Contact me for details. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From stephen.j.reynolds at talk21.com Tue Apr 30 05:51:05 2002 From: stephen.j.reynolds at talk21.com (Stephen Reynolds) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:17 2005 Subject: [Wing] calling repeat offenders Message-ID: <01f401c1f045$b140ace0$74d5be3e@oemcomputer> I would like to build an RV7 next year and for various reasons would like to build in Canada and after spending some time in Nth America (visiting OSH, Vans home coming, friends etc) fly it back to England where I live now. I am looking for someone who is a RV serial offender to help me build the plane. I live in the middle of London with a very small garage and I figure by the time I buy all the necessary bits, have them shipped over and find a place to build it would be just as easy for me to come over there and build. Certainly more interesting anyway, also it seems to me that this would concentrate my mind on the project and remove a lot of the- "uh what do I do now" enabling the aircraft to be completed in a reasonable amount of time. If someone has already built a RV (or 2) and has a workshop already set up I figure they might be interested in assisting / instructing on the build of another one. I am reasonably handy and do all my own work on my motorcycles although I have no experience of working on aircraft. I can follow plans and can work in AF and metric. I took my PPL in Australia last year whilst I was home. Since then I have flown a little in Australia and here in the UK. If anyone is interested perhaps you could drop me an email back and I will call you to discuss things a bit further, if not if there is any one else you know that may be interested perhaps you could forward this note onto them. thankyou Stephen -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020430/4c0985cd/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed May 1 10:22:48 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Virus Information Message-ID: There's no cause for panic, however there is a virus going around that has--unsuccessfully--tried to penetrate the Wing email listserver. No harm was done and you are not at any risk of receiving the virus from the Wing listserver. These are the domains from which the attack was lauched. If your email address is from one of the following domains you may have already been infected, possibly by someone else on the same domain. @aol.com @hotmail.com @lynx.org @nortel.com @sask.usask.ca @sasktel.net @verticom.com --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon May 6 13:32:07 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day Message-ID: Van's Air Force Home Wing holds an event they call "Builder's Motivation Day." On that day, members with flying RVs take active builders for rides, as motivation to help them with their projects. I'd like to hear from RV owners in the Wing whether they would be interested in participating in such an event. Home Wing does their day at a single airport (Scappoose, I think). Since Western Canada Wing is spread out across four provinces and the territories, I thought a good approach for us would be to pick a date, and organize "squadrons" at several airports where there is a concentration of builders and owners. Possible sites might be Victoria Langley (Washington members could participate there) Salmon Arm/Kamloops/Kelowna (perhaps all three?) Calgary (Springbank?) Edmonton (Villeneuve?) Regina Saskatoon Winnipeg (St. Andrews?) Right now this is just a concept, so I'm interested in what members think about it, and suggestions. If we go ahead with it, I'll be looking for volunteers in each area to help organize it. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From brjaques at pris.ca Mon May 6 14:11:00 2002 From: brjaques at pris.ca (Bruce Jaques) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day References: Message-ID: <000701c1f542$8868c9e0$24dcf4cc@brucejaques> My RV-4 was built in Villeneuve by Gordon Russel and Bill Yont. I think Gordon is working on a Spencer Amphibian and is still an active flyer. I could do a weekend there and even let Gordon take a flight in the magic carpet with a builder. I'll bet he'd be pleased. Bruce Jaques Chetwynd, B.C. PS. I'm going to sell the RV-4 this summer and look into building a new airplane. Bruce -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020506/c4351e8c/attachment.htm From rv7 at b4.ca Mon May 6 15:37:30 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day References: Message-ID: <3CD705AA.3000906@b4.ca> Sounds like a *great* idea! But then again, i'm a builder and not an owner... Anything that'll get me up in an RV is welcome... 8-) -Rob RV-7 Empennage Tedd McHenry wrote: > Right now this is just a concept, so I'm interested in what members think about > it, and suggestions. If we go ahead with it, I'll be looking for volunteers in > each area to help organize it. From ve7fp at jetstream.net Mon May 6 17:53:28 2002 From: ve7fp at jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tedd, Count Salmon Arm in. WE currently have two RV's flying and 3 under construction. Ken -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On Behalf Of Tedd McHenry Sent: Monday, May 06, 2002 1:32 PM To: Western Canada Wing List Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day Van's Air Force Home Wing holds an event they call "Builder's Motivation Day." On that day, members with flying RVs take active builders for rides, as motivation to help them with their projects. I'd like to hear from RV owners in the Wing whether they would be interested in participating in such an event. Home Wing does their day at a single airport (Scappoose, I think). Since Western Canada Wing is spread out across four provinces and the territories, I thought a good approach for us would be to pick a date, and organize "squadrons" at several airports where there is a concentration of builders and owners. Possible sites might be Victoria Langley (Washington members could participate there) Salmon Arm/Kamloops/Kelowna (perhaps all three?) Calgary (Springbank?) Edmonton (Villeneuve?) Regina Saskatoon Winnipeg (St. Andrews?) Right now this is just a concept, so I'm interested in what members think about it, and suggestions. If we go ahead with it, I'll be looking for volunteers in each area to help organize it. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org _______________________________________________ Wing mailing list Wing@vansairforce.org http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon May 6 20:19:28 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV-4 Firewall Weldments Message-ID: I'm helping a friend sell an RV-4 that he did not build. A prospective customer has asked him whether or not it has "heavy firewall weldments." How can we tell? By the way, this airplane, C-FJOJ, is advertised in Trade-a-Plane at US$45,000. It's currently based at Boundary Bay, and I'd be happy to show it to any prospective buyers. You can see some photos and specs at http://www.vansairforce.org/airplanes/C-FJOJ --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Mon May 6 21:28:45 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV-4 Firewall Weldments References: Message-ID: <002701c1f57f$ad2c5520$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> I recall seing something about some additional gussets on the fuselage side of the firewall. Tried looking in 19years of the RVator as I was almost certain that's where I saw it, but a quick leaf thru didn't find it. perhaps in your backcopies... It may not be so important with the smaller engine.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Monday, May 06, 2002 8:19 PM Subject: [Wing] RV-4 Firewall Weldments > I'm helping a friend sell an RV-4 that he did not build. A prospective > customer has asked him whether or not it has "heavy firewall weldments." How > can we tell? > > By the way, this airplane, C-FJOJ, is advertised in Trade-a-Plane at US$45,000. > It's currently based at Boundary Bay, and I'd be happy to show it to any > prospective buyers. You can see some photos and specs at > > http://www.vansairforce.org/airplanes/C-FJOJ > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From rv7 at b4.ca Tue May 7 07:06:12 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV-4 Firewall Weldments References: <002701c1f57f$ad2c5520$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <3CD7DF54.6040206@b4.ca> I'd bet a quick phone call to Vans would get you a copy of a drawing that would help, or possibly just a verbal description that would be adequate... -RB4 >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Tedd McHenry" >To: "Western Canada Wing List" >Sent: Monday, May 06, 2002 8:19 PM >Subject: [Wing] RV-4 Firewall Weldments > >>I'm helping a friend sell an RV-4 that he did not build. A prospective >>customer has asked him whether or not it has "heavy firewall weldments." >> >How > >>can we tell? >> From mdeg at shaw.ca Tue May 7 21:32:02 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV-4 Firewall Weldments References: <002701c1f57f$ad2c5520$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> <3CD7DF54.6040206@b4.ca> Message-ID: <005e01c1f649$4d3be160$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> They did make a change here...it is a heavier (thicker) piece of 4130 steel with a gusset. I am not sure what the thickness is but do know that it is possible to replace an older one with the updated version. As Rob says a call to Van's would get you the correct information. Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob Prior" To: Sent: Tuesday, May 07, 2002 8:06 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] RV-4 Firewall Weldments > I'd bet a quick phone call to Vans would get you a copy of a drawing > that would help, or possibly just a verbal description that would be > adequate... > > -RB4 > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Tedd McHenry" > >To: "Western Canada Wing List" > >Sent: Monday, May 06, 2002 8:19 PM > >Subject: [Wing] RV-4 Firewall Weldments > > > >>I'm helping a friend sell an RV-4 that he did not build. A prospective > >>customer has asked him whether or not it has "heavy firewall weldments." > >> > >How > > > >>can we tell? > >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From mdeg at shaw.ca Wed May 8 06:12:49 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day References: Message-ID: <001301c1f692$0dabb720$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> We have three flying RV's in Saskatoon and several throughout the province. It would be a great idea to do this not only for RV's (they are the greatest) but any other homebuilts which are flying as well. Marc 42 hrs and counting.....:-) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Monday, May 06, 2002 2:32 PM Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day > Van's Air Force Home Wing holds an event they call "Builder's Motivation Day." > On that day, members with flying RVs take active builders for rides, as > motivation to help them with their projects. I'd like to hear from RV owners > in the Wing whether they would be interested in participating in such an event. > > Home Wing does their day at a single airport (Scappoose, I think). Since > Western Canada Wing is spread out across four provinces and the territories, I > thought a good approach for us would be to pick a date, and organize > "squadrons" at several airports where there is a concentration of builders and > owners. Possible sites might be > > Victoria > Langley (Washington members could participate there) > Salmon Arm/Kamloops/Kelowna (perhaps all three?) > Calgary (Springbank?) > Edmonton (Villeneuve?) > Regina > Saskatoon > Winnipeg (St. Andrews?) > > Right now this is just a concept, so I'm interested in what members think about > it, and suggestions. If we go ahead with it, I'll be looking for volunteers in > each area to help organize it. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From ltodd at telus.net Wed May 8 19:51:13 2002 From: ltodd at telus.net (Linda Todd) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day References: Message-ID: <000b01c1f704$7a6edbe0$45e335d1@oemcomputer> There are about seven flying RVs at Langley and probably more builders than we know. Bob and I would be happy to participate in builder's motivation day. Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Monday, May 06, 2002 1:32 PM Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day > Van's Air Force Home Wing holds an event they call "Builder's Motivation Day." > On that day, members with flying RVs take active builders for rides, as > motivation to help them with their projects. I'd like to hear from RV owners > in the Wing whether they would be interested in participating in such an event. > > Home Wing does their day at a single airport (Scappoose, I think). Since > Western Canada Wing is spread out across four provinces and the territories, I > thought a good approach for us would be to pick a date, and organize > "squadrons" at several airports where there is a concentration of builders and > owners. Possible sites might be > > Victoria > Langley (Washington members could participate there) > Salmon Arm/Kamloops/Kelowna (perhaps all three?) > Calgary (Springbank?) > Edmonton (Villeneuve?) > Regina > Saskatoon > Winnipeg (St. Andrews?) > > Right now this is just a concept, so I'm interested in what members think about > it, and suggestions. If we go ahead with it, I'll be looking for volunteers in > each area to help organize it. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed May 8 20:11:08 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day In-Reply-To: <000b01c1f704$7a6edbe0$45e335d1@oemcomputer> Message-ID: We've heard quite a bit of of support for a Builder's Motivation Day from owners of flying RVs, but surprisingly little from builders. Those of you who are building an RV: if we organized such a day, how keen are you to come out for a ride? Are you willing to spring for the cost of fuel? Are you prepared to go to one of the airports mentioned in my previous email to get a ride? If you don't want to answer on a public forum, write to me at the address below with your thoughts. If it looks like there's strong interest in the idea all around, I'll be looking for volunteers in each area to help organize the event. It should be a pretty straightforward matter of putting builders together with flyers on a given date. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From acornyn at telusplanet.net Thu May 9 07:47:40 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day References: Message-ID: <001901c1f768$78dc0870$e71ab8a1@USER> I would be happy to if any one wants to come to Pincher Creek Alberta or they aren't too far away I could go get them RV6 flying. Al -- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 9:11 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day > We've heard quite a bit of of support for a Builder's Motivation Day from > owners of flying RVs, but surprisingly little from builders. Those of you who > are building an RV: if we organized such a day, how keen are you to come out > for a ride? Are you willing to spring for the cost of fuel? Are you prepared > to go to one of the airports mentioned in my previous email to get a ride? If > you don't want to answer on a public forum, write to me at the address below > with your thoughts. > > If it looks like there's strong interest in the idea all around, I'll be > looking for volunteers in each area to help organize the event. It should be a > pretty straightforward matter of putting builders together with flyers on a > given date. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From fvalarm at rapidnet.net Thu May 9 10:46:13 2002 From: fvalarm at rapidnet.net (B. Tomm) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day References: Message-ID: <003801c1f781$798cd880$938d35d1@cheryls> Tedd, Count me in. Bevan RV7A wings ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: Sent: May 8, 2002 8:11 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day > We've heard quite a bit of of support for a Builder's Motivation Day from > owners of flying RVs, but surprisingly little from builders. Those of you who > are building an RV: if we organized such a day, how keen are you to come out > for a ride? Are you willing to spring for the cost of fuel? Are you prepared > to go to one of the airports mentioned in my previous email to get a ride? If > you don't want to answer on a public forum, write to me at the address below > with your thoughts. > > If it looks like there's strong interest in the idea all around, I'll be > looking for volunteers in each area to help organize the event. It should be a > pretty straightforward matter of putting builders together with flyers on a > given date. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From GDube at co.whatcom.wa.us Thu May 9 12:36:20 2002 From: GDube at co.whatcom.wa.us (George Dube) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Motivation Day for Builders Message-ID: I have been building my RV6AQB for 16 months and even though I live in Arlington, Washington,USA, if and when you at Langley would have such an event, YES!! I'd make. I've got lots to ask and to look at/for. Yes, I paid for fuel & a $100 burger too. Please continue this effort it sounds great!! From wayne at pedersentransport.com Thu May 9 13:35:34 2002 From: wayne at pedersentransport.com (Wayne Pedersen) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Count me in !!! What a thrill and motivator that would be. Wayne Pedersen RV 7 a Fuse Claresholm Ab. From reagleston at ibigroup.com Thu May 9 16:22:41 2002 From: reagleston at ibigroup.com (Ron Eagleston) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tedd, Definitely interested. Ron Eagleston 8A wiring > From: Tedd McHenry > Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org > Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 20:11:08 -0700 (PDT) > To: wing@vansairforce.org > Subject: Re: [Wing] Builder's Motivation Day > > > We've heard quite a bit of of support for a Builder's Motivation Day from > owners of flying RVs, but surprisingly little from builders. Those of you who > are building an RV: if we organized such a day, how keen are you to come out > for a ride? Are you willing to spring for the cost of fuel? Are you prepared > to go to one of the airports mentioned in my previous email to get a ride? If > you don't want to answer on a public forum, write to me at the address below > with your thoughts. > > If it looks like there's strong interest in the idea all around, I'll be > looking for volunteers in each area to help organize the event. It should be > a > pretty straightforward matter of putting builders together with flyers on a > given date. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From 2w at telus.net Thu May 9 16:32:06 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (William Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Motivation Day Message-ID: <002201c1f7b1$c1825220$ad9eb742@bc.hsia.telus.net> Tedd I would be a interested participent. Bill Robson RV-6 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020509/b9facf72/attachment.htm From ltodd at telus.net Fri May 10 06:49:51 2002 From: ltodd at telus.net (Linda Todd) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Motivation Day for Builders References: Message-ID: <002d01c1f829$90563180$5be335d1@oemcomputer> George, If you come to the Langley RV fly in on June 8th look for Bob Baldock or myself. We have 2 flying RV6s and would be happy to talk to you about building. Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Dube" To: Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2002 12:36 PM Subject: [Wing] Motivation Day for Builders > I have been building my RV6AQB for 16 months and even > though I live in Arlington, Washington,USA, if and when > you at Langley would have such an event, YES!! I'd make. > I've got lots to ask and to look at/for. Yes, I paid for fuel & > a $100 burger too. Please continue this effort it sounds > great!! > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From carpenter at globalserve.net Fri May 10 12:25:56 2002 From: carpenter at globalserve.net (Chris Carpenter) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder Motivation Day Message-ID: As an RV-8 builder, I would be more than happy to spring for fuel for a ride in an RV at Langley. Chris From gordjack at telus.net Sat May 11 00:59:19 2002 From: gordjack at telus.net (Gordon Jack) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Builder Motivation Day References: Message-ID: <3CDCCF57.9000201@telus.net> We'll (Karen and Gord) be at Langley that weekend, we won't need a ride , however any one offered will "NOT" be declined. Pass our ride on to someone who has not been on one. We'll even spring for the fuel. The RV society has less to do with the plane than the people. I picked up my stab kit the Wednesday before the fathers day weekend at Salmon Arm and meeting all the wonderful people, RV flyers and builders there was a very positive and motivating experience. Talking to a few of the Home wing flyers(Randall, Robb, Scottt etc.) was very motivating . Their appreciation and respect for our Country was obvious. The common demoninator was the love of the RV. We want to meet Austin. Gordon Jack Prince George B.C. RV 7A 70011 (wings) From gmcnutt at intergate.ca Sat May 11 19:35:40 2002 From: gmcnutt at intergate.ca (George McNutt) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV's and Gross Weight Message-ID: About a month ago I posted a message on this list about having difficulty getting the MD-RA to issue a Special CofA for my RV-6A aircraft with a requested 1750 pound Gross Weight. MD-RA were insisting on a letter of approval from Van's. The MD-RA have lots of these letters in their files but they are no longer available from Vans. I recieved my Special CofA directly from Transport Canada at the requested 1750 pounds, without hassle, and without a letter from Van's. For those following in my footsteps and who may run into this problem you may contact me directly at gmcnutt@intergate.ca for information. George McNutt Flying. From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed May 15 11:31:37 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer Message-ID: I've been asked by the Rec Flyer (RAAC magazine) to produce a regular column on RVs. I think it's a great idea, and I truly would like to do it, but between the Wing, my own RV project, and my other commitments, I don't feel that I can take it on. If you're interested in writing about RVs for the Rec Flyer, please contact me. I'd like to take advantage of this offer. Perhaps several of us can take turns writing the column, so that we each have to do only one a year or so. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From brjaques at pris.ca Wed May 15 22:14:19 2002 From: brjaques at pris.ca (Bruce Jaques) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer References: Message-ID: <000501c1fc98$8a220b40$26dcf4cc@brucejaques> I could write some dandy anecdotes but wouldn't want to be responsible for regular submissions. It's a good idea and I think there's potential some wonderful hanger stories. Bruce Jaques RV-4 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020515/08e11554/attachment.htm From mdeg at shaw.ca Thu May 16 06:28:34 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer References: Message-ID: <000901c1fcdd$940aeb00$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> I could write an RV related article, but would not want to do a regular column either........ Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2002 12:31 PM Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer > I've been asked by the Rec Flyer (RAAC magazine) to produce a regular column on > RVs. I think it's a great idea, and I truly would like to do it, but between > the Wing, my own RV project, and my other commitments, I don't feel that I can > take it on. If you're interested in writing about RVs for the Rec Flyer, > please contact me. I'd like to take advantage of this offer. Perhaps several > of us can take turns writing the column, so that we each have to do only one a > year or so. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From rv7 at b4.ca Thu May 16 09:08:48 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer References: <000901c1fcdd$940aeb00$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <3CE3D990.1040802@b4.ca> I think a lot of us are in the same boat. Why don't we all write up the articles we have in mind, and give them to Tedd for submission? He can send them all on to the Rec Flyer folks one per issue. Just try to make them non-topical (ie. if they get published 6 months from now, they shouldn't seem too dated). -RB4 rv7 "at" b4.ca RV7 Empennage Marc Degirolamo wrote: > I could write an RV related article, but would not want to do a regular > column either........ > Marc From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu May 16 09:29:43 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer In-Reply-To: <3CE3D990.1040802@b4.ca> Message-ID: Rob: > Why don't we all write up the > articles we have in mind, and give them to Tedd for submission? That's an excellent suggestion. If you're interested in writing an article about RVs for submission to the Rec Flyer, email me (or this list) the subject you have in mind. I'll coordinate the subjects (so we don't get two articles about the same thing), and work with the Rec Flyer on a publishing schedule. I'll also get some details from the Rec Flyer about the desired length of the articles, how to handle photos and graphics, and so on. Tedd From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu May 16 15:05:22 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer In-Reply-To: Message-ID: By the way, if anyone has suggestions for RV-related articles you'd like to see in the Rec Flyer, post them here and I'll see if I can find someone to write them. Tedd From mdeg at shaw.ca Thu May 16 15:41:10 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer References: <000901c1fcdd$940aeb00$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> <3CE3D990.1040802@b4.ca> Message-ID: <003b01c1fd2a$c6e90be0$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Sounds like a good idea...........now I just have to put the plane away long enough to get an article written..... Marc 43 hrs and counting..... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rob Prior" To: Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2002 10:08 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer > I think a lot of us are in the same boat. Why don't we all write up the > articles we have in mind, and give them to Tedd for submission? He can > send them all on to the Rec Flyer folks one per issue. Just try to make > them non-topical (ie. if they get published 6 months from now, they > shouldn't seem too dated). > > -RB4 > rv7 "at" b4.ca > RV7 Empennage > > Marc Degirolamo wrote: > > > I could write an RV related article, but would not want to do a regular > > column either........ > > Marc > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Thu May 16 15:05:50 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer References: Message-ID: <005b01c1fd25$d75d0760$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Would my lengthy article on how I got the Grin be any good if it was chopped up? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2002 3:05 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] RV Column in Rec Flyer > By the way, if anyone has suggestions for RV-related articles you'd like to see > in the Rec Flyer, post them here and I'll see if I can find someone to write > them. > > Tedd > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri May 17 10:38:50 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Builder's Seminar Message-ID: A question for newbie and wannabe RV builders: I'm doing an introductory seminar on RV building at the Langley RV fly-in. It's targeted at the new builder or person who's thinking of starting an RV but still has questions or reservations. If you are such a person, what topices would you like to see covered by the seminar? --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From rv7 at b4.ca Sun May 19 11:17:00 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Builder's Seminar References: Message-ID: <3CE7EC1C.8070804@b4.ca> Some thoughts: Initial stuff: What model to choose? Building stuff: Riveting: Squeezing and driving Painting: Priming with one-part, two-part, alodine, spray-bomb, etc Tools: What to buy first Workshop: How much space do I need? Maybe the "making the decision" links on the Vans website would be a good start? -RB4 Tedd McHenry wrote: >A question for newbie and wannabe RV builders: > >I'm doing an introductory seminar on RV building at the Langley RV fly-in. >It's targeted at the new builder or person who's thinking of starting an RV but >still has questions or reservations. If you are such a person, what topices >would you like to see covered by the seminar? > >--- > >Tedd McHenry >Van's Air Force >Western Canada Wing >tedd@vansairforce.org >www.vansairforce.org > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > -- --------- Rob Prior rv7 "at" b4.ca ----------------------------- Stop dreaming... Start flying From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed May 22 12:20:09 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-in, June 8 Message-ID: Just a reminder that the Langley RV Fly-in is coming up in about two weeks, on Saturday, June 8. There will be seminars by Bart Lalonde and Eustace Bowhay, RV training with Mike Seager, awards for RVs, and lots of other features. You can read all about it on our web site, at http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/ The web site also has flight guide information for CYNJ, border crossing instructions for aircraft arriving from the U.S., and information on our discount rate at the local Travelodge. If the weather is good, we expect an excellent turnout of RVs, many from quite some distance away. Please write me if you have any questions, or to book a session with Mike Seager. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri May 24 16:43:04 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Rides TO the Langley Fly-in Message-ID: A Wing member from Chase, BC, signed the Langley fly-in guest book the other day and commented that he's looking for a ride to the fly-in. Chase is between Kamloops and Salmon Arm. If you can offer him a ride, write to me and I'll give you his email address. I'd like to try to put people who need rides to the fly-in together with people who have empty seats in their car or airplane. If you'd like to come to the fly-in but need a ride, or if you're coming and have a spare seat you'd like to offer, write to the list and maybe we can get a few people to the fly-in who otherwise wouldn't make it. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat May 25 21:30:14 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Bill Young Accident Message-ID: Wing member Bill Young, of Westbank, BC, survived a crash in the mountains with his RV-6 today. I have very few details at this point, and I don't want to fuel rumours or speculation. However, I will say that Bill is being transferred to the burn unit at Victoria General Hospital, although he is not there just yet. Tomorrow I'll arranged to have a card sent to him from the Wing (flowers aren't allowed in the burn unit). If you want to send a card yourself, the address is Burn Unit Victoria General Hospital 1900 Fort Street Victoria, BC V8R 1J8 --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon May 27 21:41:26 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley: Bad News But Good News Message-ID: First the bad news: Bart Lalonde is unable to attend the Langley RV Fly-in on June 8, at which he was scheduled to give a seminar on engines for RVs. Now the good news: Ken Fowler has generously offered to take Bart's spot on the schedule and give a seminar on aerobatic and airshow flying in RVs and Rockets. Many of you have seen Ken's airshow routine. He puts on a spectacular show, and is without a doubt the finest Rocket aerobatic pilot in the world. I look forward to seeing you all at the fly-in. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From 2w at telus.net Tue May 28 08:32:58 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (William Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Fly-in Message-ID: <000e01c2065c$f26294e0$5792b742@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello Tedd What can you tell us about parking? Has any arrangements been made regarding getting to the Langley Airport? Bill -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020528/37e5effd/attachment.htm From 2w at telus.net Tue May 28 08:36:06 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (William Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Fly-in Message-ID: <001901c2065d$620dec40$5792b742@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello again Where can a person get a schedule of the daily events and seminars. Regards Bill -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020528/80b7d1ce/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue May 28 10:26:30 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Fly-in In-Reply-To: <001901c2065d$620dec40$5792b742@bc.hsia.telus.net> Message-ID: Bill: Parking for the Langley fly-in will be on the north side of the grass strip. Enter the airport from 56 Avenue. There's room for many, many cars. Refer to the map at http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/cynj_layout_taxi.jpg (there's a link to that page on the fly-in web site; see below). The seminar schedule, and all the other information you'll need, is on the fly-in web site, http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/ Tedd --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From 2w at telus.net Tue May 28 15:14:48 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (William Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley Fly-in References: Message-ID: <000501c20695$14f528a0$5792b742@bc.hsia.telus.net> Thanks Tedd Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Tuesday, May 28, 2002 10:26 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] Langley Fly-in > Bill: > > Parking for the Langley fly-in will be on the north side of the grass strip. > Enter the airport from 56 Avenue. There's room for many, many cars. Refer to > the map at > > http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/cynj_layout_taxi.jpg > > (there's a link to that page on the fly-in web site; see below). > > The seminar schedule, and all the other information you'll need, is on the > fly-in web site, > > http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/ > > Tedd > > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Jun 8 22:49:38 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Photos from Langley Fly-in Message-ID: You can see some photos from today's RV fly-in at Langley on the Wing web site, at http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/ Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Jun 15 10:19:48 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-in Photos Message-ID: All the photos from the Langley RV Fly-in are now posted on the Wing web site, including Rob Prior's excellent camera work. You can navigate to the photos from the main page by following the link to "Social Events," or you can jump directly there from this URL: http://www.vansairforce.org/events/langley_2002.html --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Jun 18 21:46:19 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Great Midwest RV & Experimental Fly-In (fwd) Message-ID: Here's a message about the Great Midwest RV & Experimental Fly-In near Kansas City, for any of you that might be within reach of Kansas this weekend. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2002 21:26:59 -0500 From: Kevin Vap Subject: [Webmasters] Great Midwest RV & Experimental Fly-In Webmasters: The 4th Annual Great Midwest RV & Experimental Fly-In has been scheduled for Saturday June 22nd, at Chiles Airpark (69KS). This is just south of the Kansas City metro area. Please put it on your calendars (sorry for the late notice...I just found it out myself). For details, go to http://www.vap.org/kcrvators/flyin.html and click on the link. Kevin Vap KC RVators From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Jun 20 21:06:02 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Dynon Development EFIS-D10 (long) Message-ID: I visited Dynon Development today, makers of the EFIS-D10. If you're not familiar with the EFIS-D10, you can read about it at http://www.dynondevelopment.com./ The EFIS-D10 is a combined AI, ALT, ASI, VSI, gyro compass, T&B, clock, and G-meter in a single unit, with an EFIS display. It isn't shipping yet, but they expect to be shipping "in a few months," according to Nick, the fellow I met with there. I saw a working prototype, and it looks pretty functional at this stage, but it's hard to know how much was "vapourware." I did get a chance to pick the unit up and carry it outside into the bright sunshine. This answered the three main questions I had about it: how readable is it; how readable is it in bright sunlight; and how smooth is the display during manoeuvres? It exceeded my expectation on two of the three questions, and has perfectly adequate performance on the third. The unit is quite readable, despite being only 1/4 VGA (3" diagonal?). I have better than 20/20 uncorrected vision, so I can't comment on how people with poorer vision might find it. But I would guess that anyone with vision good enough to pass a pilot medical won't have a problem with it. Naturally, bigger would be better, and Nick said they hope to one day offer a larger screen. But the current format is the best they feel they can offer and still stay within the price point they've set. (Their initial price projection is US$1,995. My advice is to get in early. I think this unit will catch on, and I think they will raise their price once they feel they've honoured their initial offer long enough.) I was very impressed with the EFIS-D10's readability in direct sunlight. I thought this would be its fatal flaw, but I was dead wrong. I stood in direct, very bright afternoon sunlight, with the sun coming right over my shoulder and hitting the screen square on. There was some glare from the surface, but it was quite readable. I simulated a sunshade with my hand, and the EFIS-D10 was as readable then as it was under indoor office lighting. I give it full marks on this test, much better than I expected. The only area where I was slightly disappointed was the smoothness of the display. The "horizon" indication is perfectly fine, but rapid rotation caused noticeable jerkiness in the compass display. However, you'd never have your head in the cockpit for any manoeuvre that would generate the kind of turn rate necessary to produce the jerkiness. I suspect that the altitude and airspeed displays would be the same, although there was no way for me to produce rapid rates of change in those displays. But again, this is not something you are ever going to see in the airplane. The horizon display--all the displays, in fact--are quite smooth in "normal" manoeuvring. If you were to glance at the display while coming over the top of a high yo-yo, trying to get on your buddies six, you'd know it wasn't an F-18 HUD. But at US$1,995, who's complaining? The gyro technology in the EFIS-D10 is pretty clever. The gyros are semiconductor devices. They use a micro-oscillator on a chip. It's solid state, and should provide many years of reliable service. There's an internal back-up battery, which they estimate will be good for about two hours, plus provision for two external power sources (i.e. a main and a back-up external power source). There's also a serial port for installing software updates. The general quality of the instrument is good, considering its price. It's built from off-the-shelf, high-volume (i.e. PC) technology, for the most part. So we're not talking about a MIL spec or TSO device here. But neither does it seem cheap. The chassis looks quite sturdy, and the buttons have a reasonably solid feel to them. I would not bet my life in IMC on this device, but I'd say it's perfectly adequate for day and night VFR flying. (By the way, I think it would be delightful to use for IFR flying. But it doesn't have the pedigree to give me the warm fuzzy feeling I want when I'm in cloud.) One thing I forgot to ask about was if there's a brightness adjustment for night flying. I'll send them that question and post the answer to the Wing. All-in-all I was very impressed with the EFIS-D10, and it's on the wish list for my RV-6. If you're building a VFR panel, this unit has all the non-engine instruments you need in one package. Of course, back-up ALT and ASI are a good idea, but you'd really only need those three in your panel, plus engine instruments. When you consider the cost of an AI, that's a pretty good deal. Oh yeah, AOA will eventually be available, too, for an extra two hundred bucks or so. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Jun 21 11:22:51 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:18 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Dynon Development EFIS-D10 (long) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I got a reply from Dynon Development about the dimming feature on the D10. Yes, it does have dimming, in increments from "very bright" to "very dark." --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Jun 27 17:59:29 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Wing Membership Message-ID: I'm happy to report that membership in the Wing reached 200 yesterday. This email group has 87 of those members. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From payaremchuk at hotmail.com Sat Jun 29 10:55:11 2002 From: payaremchuk at hotmail.com (Perry Yaremchuk) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #107 - 1 msg Message-ID: Dear Tedd, Congrats on making the wing web group such a success! At the same time, it's almost refreshing to hear that over half aren't yet burdened with the unbridled joy of the internet...or 'groups' or e-mail. Just think how much work they're getting done on their aircraft!?!?! Makes one think, doesn't it? regards, Perry Yaremchuk Kamloops RV-9 dreamer >From: wing-request@vansairforce.org >Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org >To: wing@vansairforce.org >Subject: Wing digest, Vol 1 #107 - 1 msg >Date: Fri, 28 Jun 2002 12:01:02 -0700 > >Send Wing mailing list submissions to > wing@vansairforce.org > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > wing-request@vansairforce.org > >You can reach the person managing the list at > wing-admin@vansairforce.org > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Contents of Wing digest..." > > >Today's Topics: > > 1. Wing Membership (Tedd McHenry) > >--__--__-- > >Message: 1 >Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2002 17:59:29 -0700 (PDT) >From: Tedd McHenry >To: Western Canada Wing List >Subject: [Wing] Wing Membership >Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org > >I'm happy to report that membership in the Wing reached 200 yesterday. >This >email group has 87 of those members. > >--- > >Tedd McHenry >Van's Air Force >Western Canada Wing >tedd@vansairforce.org >www.vansairforce.org > > > >--__--__-- > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > >End of Wing Digest _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Jun 29 12:11:50 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #107 - 1 msg In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Congrats on making the wing web group such a success! At the same time, it's > almost refreshing to hear that over half aren't yet burdened with the > unbridled joy of the internet...or 'groups' or e-mail. Just think how much > work they're getting done on their aircraft!?!?! Perry: Thanks for the congratulations. Actually, though, only thirty of our 200 members don't have an email address attached to their membership listing, and some of those probably have email but don't have their address listed with me. A lot (nearly half) have chosen to belong the wing but not the email group. Perhaps these are the people that are doing all the building! Tedd From mdeg at shaw.ca Sun Jun 30 19:58:12 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Wing Membership References: Message-ID: <006101c220ab$233a1260$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> that's' great Ted........big pat onthe back !! ps: I see that the Langley flyin was a huge success.......nice pictures of great looking airplanes. Hope that I can make it out there someday. Marc C-FRVE......starting to stretch her legs...... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2002 6:59 PM Subject: [Wing] Wing Membership > I'm happy to report that membership in the Wing reached 200 yesterday. This > email group has 87 of those members. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Sun Jun 30 22:28:52 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Wing Membership In-Reply-To: <006101c220ab$233a1260$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Message-ID: > ps: I see that the Langley flyin was a huge success.......nice pictures of > great looking airplanes. Hope that I can make it out there someday. > Marc Thanks, Marc. We will be holding the RV fly-in again next year, so start making your plans! Tedd From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Jul 17 20:49:38 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV-4 For Sale Message-ID: RV-4 C-FJOJ is for sale. The airplane is based at Boundary Bay, and you can see its web page at http://www.vansairforce.org/airplanes/C-FJOJ/ The asking price is US$45,000. I have flown this airplane recently (took it to Arlington last Sunday), and can tell you that it's in very good shape and flies beautifully. The engine was majored about 300-400 hours ago. Details below. Make: Van's Model: RV-4 Serial No.: BWS-4 Mark: C-FJOJ Year of Manufacture: 1991 Engine Manufacture: Avco Lycoming Model: O-320-E2D Serial: 13390027A Hour Meter: 0523.25 Propellor Manufacture: Colin Walker Model: 68X71 Wood Serial: W93366 E.L.T. GPS - Apollo GX55 Nav - Bendix/King K497A TSO Transponder - Bendix/King KT76A --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Jul 18 18:52:14 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] SPECIAL DATES FROM THE KAMLOOPS FLYING CLUB (fwd) Message-ID: Forwarded message from Norman Reed of the Kamloops Flying Club. --- DEAR BC FLYERS: The Kamloops Flying Club has decided to ESTABLISH A REGULAR TRADITION of having a breakfast fly-in on the THIRD SUNDAY OF EVERY MONTH throughout the flying season. For this year these new "traditional" fly-ins will be on AUGUST 18, SEPTEMBER 22, and OCTOBER 20th, all starting at 8AM. These dates are IN ADDITION TO our airport appreciation day and breakfast already scheduled for SEPT. 15th. PLEASE PASS THIS MESSAGE ON to as many as possible who may be interested. A flyer announcing this tradition will follow shortly in the mail. If you need further info please do not hesitate to contact me, the KFC secretary. Cheers and Safe Flying Norm Reed (Cessna 150L - C-FQNA) KFC Secretary Phone (H) 250-573-4109, (W) 250-828-5451, email nreed@cariboo.bc.ca From 2w at telus.net Tue Jul 30 17:07:58 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (William Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Wing Message-ID: <004601c23826$545d2b60$bd2306cf@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello Tedd What web address do I use to view the Wings Web Page Bill -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020730/094a4a5c/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Jul 30 18:45:31 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Possible AeroElectric Connection workshop in Portland (fwd) Message-ID: This is a forwarded message from the Home Wing that I though some Western Canada Wing members might be interested in. Hillsboro is Hillsboro, Oregon. Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 15:36:14 -0700 From: Randy Lervold To: randy@rv-8.com Subject: Possible AeroElectric Connection workshop in Portland Home Wingers, This e-mail is being sent to assess interest in hosting a workshop locally by Bob Nuckolls of AeroElectric Connection. The date would be in September or October and probably be in the Hillsboro area. Bob has been doing these workshops for many years now and has become the de facto guru of experimental aircraft electrical systems. The workshop is a day and a half long (all day Saturday, first half Sunday) and costs $150. You can see more detail at... http://www.aeroelectric.com/seminars/seminars.html Having attended this seminar in Eugene myself a few years ago I can tell you it is invaluable in designing your electrical system, and more importantly in learning about *why* things are done a certain way. Bob is not shy about sharing his opinion on many topics and has the credentials to back it up. Dave Carlson is collecting names and will coordinate with Bob if there is sufficient interest. If you are interested please contact Dave at: 503-245-8980 or davelcarlson@msn.com. Randy Lervold RV-8 N558RL From ham at hammcc.com Wed Jul 31 04:04:36 2002 From: ham at hammcc.com (Hamilton McClymont) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Possible AeroElectric Connection workshop in Portland (fwd) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I attended one of Bob's workshops in Racine, WI last August. There was a wide variety of experience with things electrical among the participants, and Bob managed to make the two days comprehensible, interesting and worthwhile for all of us. Hammy 414-750-3167 (til 16 August) 604-241-2480 www.hammcc.com > -----Original Message----- > From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On > Behalf Of Tedd McHenry > Sent: July 30, 2002 6:46 PM > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: [Wing] Possible AeroElectric Connection workshop in Portland > (fwd) > > > This is a forwarded message from the Home Wing that I though some Western > Canada Wing members might be interested in. Hillsboro is > Hillsboro, Oregon. > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 15:36:14 -0700 > From: Randy Lervold > To: randy@rv-8.com > Subject: Possible AeroElectric Connection workshop in Portland > > Home Wingers, > > This e-mail is being sent to assess interest in hosting a workshop locally > by Bob Nuckolls of AeroElectric Connection. The date would be in September > or October and probably be in the Hillsboro area. Bob has been doing these > workshops for many years now and has become the de facto guru of > experimental aircraft electrical systems. The workshop is a day and a half > long (all day Saturday, first half Sunday) and costs $150. You > can see more > detail at... > http://www.aeroelectric.com/seminars/seminars.html > > Having attended this seminar in Eugene myself a few years ago I > can tell you > it is invaluable in designing your electrical system, and more importantly > in learning about *why* things are done a certain way. Bob is not > shy about > sharing his opinion on many topics and has the credentials to back it up. > > Dave Carlson is collecting names and will coordinate with Bob if there is > sufficient interest. If you are interested please contact Dave at: > 503-245-8980 or davelcarlson@msn.com. > > Randy Lervold > RV-8 N558RL > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Aug 15 14:27:18 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] RAA Web Site and Forum Message-ID: <1029446838.3d5c1cb65d1f3@webmail.retrix.com> If you've tried to use the RAA web site or email Forum lately you will have found that you couldn't. Apparently, the RAA has had a problem with its internet service and has been down for about a week. They expect to be up and running in a few days. Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org ------------------------------------------------------- This mail sent with Retrix Webmail From 2w at telus.net Thu Aug 22 22:39:03 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (William Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Electric Connection at Hillsboro OR. Message-ID: <000e01c24a67$655129a0$bd2306cf@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello Tedd Do you know of any body planning to attend the Electric Connection in Hillsboro OR. on October 12 & 13. I would like to team up with someone for the trip. Regards Bill Robson -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020822/7199d01d/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Aug 23 08:28:56 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Electric Connection at Hillsboro OR. In-Reply-To: <000e01c24a67$655129a0$bd2306cf@bc.hsia.telus.net> Message-ID: On Thu, 22 Aug 2002, William Robson wrote: > Hello Tedd > Do you know of any body planning to attend the Electric Connection in Hillsboro OR. on October 12 & 13. I would like to team up with someone for the trip. > Regards > Bill Robson > Bill: No, I don't, but if I hear of anyone I'll let you know. Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From ham at hammcc.com Fri Aug 23 08:38:29 2002 From: ham at hammcc.com (Hamilton McClymont) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Electric Connection at Hillsboro OR. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: FWIW, I took the course in Racine WI a year ago, and I found it good value. Hammy 604-241-2480 www.hammcc.com > -----Original Message----- > From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On > Behalf Of Tedd McHenry > Sent: August 23, 2002 8:29 AM > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: Re: [Wing] Electric Connection at Hillsboro OR. > > > On Thu, 22 Aug 2002, William Robson wrote: > > > Hello Tedd > > Do you know of any body planning to attend the Electric > Connection in Hillsboro OR. on October 12 & 13. I would like to > team up with someone for the trip. > > Regards > > Bill Robson > > > > Bill: > > No, I don't, but if I hear of anyone I'll let you know. > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From rdkennett at shaw.ca Fri Aug 23 21:54:35 2002 From: rdkennett at shaw.ca (Della & Robert Kennett) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] First Flight Message-ID: <001b01c24b2a$5853ed00$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Just thought I'd let everyone know that my RV6A flew for the first time tonight with Chuck Ross at the controls. The half hour flight went extremely well, with the only concern a high CHT on #3 cylinder. There doesn't appear to be the usual problems with a heavy wing or any other rigging problems evident. In Chuck's words, "the errors in construction must have cancelled themselves out", and "flies just like an RV". Many thanks to my patient and understanding wife Della, and also the numerous RV builders who have provided advice, tools, and help over the past 5 1/2 years while this project has edged towards completion. Also, special thanks to Chuck for making the first flight. Rob Kennett Westbank, B.C. RV6A C-GRBK -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020823/0dc8c99d/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Aug 23 22:04:45 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] First Flight In-Reply-To: <001b01c24b2a$5853ed00$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Message-ID: Rob: On Fri, 23 Aug 2002, Della & Robert Kennett wrote: > Just thought I'd let everyone know that my RV6A flew for the first time tonight with Chuck Ross at the controls. Great news, and congratulations! It's always motivating to hear these stories, for those of us still building. Tedd McHenry From jjewell at telus.net Fri Aug 23 22:38:09 2002 From: jjewell at telus.net (Jim Jewell) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] First Flight References: <001b01c24b2a$5853ed00$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <000c01c24b30$6e4dc8a0$d5d6b742@bc.hsia.telus.net> Great news!!! Good on ya Rob. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: Della & Robert Kennett To: Wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 9:54 PM Subject: [Wing] First Flight Just thought I'd let everyone know that my RV6A flew for the first time tonight with Chuck Ross at the controls. The half hour flight went extremely well, with the only concern a high CHT on #3 cylinder. There doesn't appear to be the usual problems with a heavy wing or any other rigging problems evident. In Chuck's words, "the errors in construction must have cancelled themselves out", and "flies just like an RV". Many thanks to my patient and understanding wife Della, and also the numerous RV builders who have provided advice, tools, and help over the past 5 1/2 years while this project has edged towards completion. Also, special thanks to Chuck for making the first flight. Rob Kennett Westbank, B.C. RV6A C-GRBK -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020823/0e5df0fd/attachment.htm From mdeg at shaw.ca Sat Aug 24 07:24:36 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] First Flight References: <001b01c24b2a$5853ed00$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <000d01c24b79$f9827e40$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> congratulations Rob...... Marc DeGirolamo ----- Original Message ----- From: Della & Robert Kennett To: Wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 10:54 PM Subject: [Wing] First Flight Just thought I'd let everyone know that my RV6A flew for the first time tonight with Chuck Ross at the controls. The half hour flight went extremely well, with the only concern a high CHT on #3 cylinder. There doesn't appear to be the usual problems with a heavy wing or any other rigging problems evident. In Chuck's words, "the errors in construction must have cancelled themselves out", and "flies just like an RV". Many thanks to my patient and understanding wife Della, and also the numerous RV builders who have provided advice, tools, and help over the past 5 1/2 years while this project has edged towards completion. Also, special thanks to Chuck for making the first flight. Rob Kennett Westbank, B.C. RV6A C-GRBK -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020824/a9d36fe2/attachment.htm From wjoke at shaw.ca Sat Aug 24 08:19:03 2002 From: wjoke at shaw.ca (Jim Oke) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] First Flight References: <001b01c24b2a$5853ed00$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <01c801c24b81$94c380a0$6401a8c0@cd708596a> Congratulations. Always good to hear of a successful "first flight" - helps keeps the rest of us going! Jim Oke RV-6A - C-GKGZ (reserved) - painting someday soon... Winnipeg, Man. ----- Original Message ----- From: Della & Robert Kennett To: Wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 11:54 PM Subject: [Wing] First Flight Just thought I'd let everyone know that my RV6A flew for the first time tonight with Chuck Ross at the controls. The half hour flight went extremely well, with the only concern a high CHT on #3 cylinder. There doesn't appear to be the usual problems with a heavy wing or any other rigging problems evident. In Chuck's words, "the errors in construction must have cancelled themselves out", and "flies just like an RV". Many thanks to my patient and understanding wife Della, and also the numerous RV builders who have provided advice, tools, and help over the past 5 1/2 years while this project has edged towards completion. Also, special thanks to Chuck for making the first flight. Rob Kennett Westbank, B.C. RV6A C-GRBK -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020824/326a2b5f/attachment.htm From ltodd at telus.net Sat Aug 24 20:10:16 2002 From: ltodd at telus.net (Linda Todd) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] First Flight In-Reply-To: <001b01c24b2a$5853ed00$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Message-ID: Congratulations! Just in case you're looking for some place to fly to when you have your 25 hours, how about visiting Langley. We have about 8 RVs resident on the field (west side) and there is usually always one of us around somewhere. Linda Todd -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On Behalf Of Della & Robert Kennett Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 9:55 PM To: Wing@vansairforce.org Subject: [Wing] First Flight Just thought I'd let everyone know that my RV6A flew for the first time tonight with Chuck Ross at the controls. The half hour flight went extremely well, with the only concern a high CHT on #3 cylinder. There doesn't appear to be the usual problems with a heavy wing or any other rigging problems evident. In Chuck's words, "the errors in construction must have cancelled themselves out", and "flies just like an RV". Many thanks to my patient and understanding wife Della, and also the numerous RV builders who have provided advice, tools, and help over the past 5 1/2 years while this project has edged towards completion. Also, special thanks to Chuck for making the first flight. Rob Kennett Westbank, B.C. RV6A C-GRBK -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020824/e26c7e51/attachment.htm From jjewell at telus.net Sat Aug 31 14:46:11 2002 From: jjewell at telus.net (Jim Jewell) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Visit References: Message-ID: <007f01c25137$d2a3da80$d5d6b742@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hi Hammy, I just thought I would drop a line and tell you that it was a real pleasure to have you visit with us. Please do come again whenever the mood strikes. Something said to me the other day; "I came into this world with nothing and so far I still have most of it left" Jim P.S. Did you get to the bottom of the grounded mag/s? From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Sat Sep 14 08:35:21 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) Message-ID: <002b01c25c04$566e77e0$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaye and Scott Jackson To: rv-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 10:45 PM Subject: First Flight! (Long) After six-and-a-half years of winter-time building, two moves, one-and-a-half years in storage,about fifty-thousand Canadian dollars( about 450USD), and several final hours spent working up normal and emergency checklists and practicing a bailout routine-I made the canopy jettisonable: I am both pleased( strike that, Moneypenny; make that thrilled) as well as disappointed to announce that RV-6 #24613 has left the nest as of 16Aug02. Into a light wind, the Imitutor surged down the runway and leapt into the clear, evening sky, giving real meaning to the word airBORNE for me. For fourty minutes, while being put through the manoeuvres recommended in "Flight Testing Homebuilt Aircraft", we scribed gentle circles over the tidal flats downwind of the into-wind runway as I became acquainted with the vibration and control feel during clean and partial-flap turns and stalls. A pratice go-around was followed by a surprisingly gentle touchdown and straighforward rollout. Sitting on a piece of foamy cut from the kids' sleeping bag underlay-which they haven't yet discovered, I felt trussed like a Christmas turkey in Nomex suit and gloves, leather boots, life vest( the runway ends at the dike holding back the Pacific Ocean),parachute and an old, Gentex helmet on which I kept the tinted visor down; ostensibly to give additional protection from a birstrike with one of the steady streams of seagulls returning to the ocean from the city dump after supper; but actually so no one could see I needed my half-frame glasses just to see the instruments. The workshop is now cold, dark and quiet. The silhouette of the fuselage is faintly visible on the floor, outlined by paint overspray. You'd have to look through the layer of drilled-off rivet heads and punched-out tails, sharp little coils of aluminum looking like shiny curly fries, short lengths of wiring insulation, heatshrink and plastic tubing that look enough like macaroni to keep fooling our terrier, fine aluminum powder from the Scotchbrite wheel and white curlies and powder from cutting and fitting the canopy, brown stripes of masking tape and the twin, green stripes of rivetting tape. I know it wouldn't hurt to look around for the broom, but I felt the shop had atmosphere. I'd like to personally thank the wise people who invented plastic-covered aluminum sheet, oops rivets, blind rivets, brad-point drills, rivet-spacing fans, Unibits, HVLP and Scotchbrite wheels. Also those patient folk on this list who take the time to explain the stupidest questions for the rest of us. And controller Rick, who graciously sent all other traffic at Canada's third-busiest airport to the crosswind runway and kept them all away from me. On the other hand, if I ever come across the masochists who thought up Proseal, fibreglass, Phillips-head screws or fly cutters...... To list the people instrumental in this experience, I would have to start with Peter Jarman. This is all his fault for giving me a key to his 180hp RV-4 after I helped him wire and finish it. It only took a few flights before I had a serious case of," I want one!" He loaned me all his building tools over half-a decade ago, and made numerous, hour-long trips to the shop on his unmuffled Harley. The neighbours must've thought we were drug dealers. He phoned frequently, not even saying Hi, just starting with,"What are you doing on your airplane today?" Whenver he sensed I was flagging, we would go somewhere in his -4. Coming from a military family, I respond best to butt-kicking, and he's verbally kicked mine for six years. Thanks, Peter. Sorry about breaking the trigger off your rivet gun. Many others also helped and the wall by the shop phone is covered with their phone nuimbers. Jim Asprey was our inspector as well as building his own -6. He eased the pain of the mandatory $642 fee for the final inspection by spending over four hours on, in and under it so I at least felt like I was getting something for the money. Brian Carr has built seven of these and had an answer for every dumb question.Milt Sadoway would interrupt buidling his Rocket whenever I needed help. Tedd McHenry skipped supper on short notice to act as follow-on vehicle on the move to the airport. August P. was kind enough to let me abuse his -6 in a rehearsal of the test flight and several circuits just hours before it happened for real. Oldest child, and our only son, Gregory, helped rivet the empennage but discovered girls when the wings arrived. Oldest daughter Vanessa, who can't wait to learn to fly, spent one evening in the tailcone lying on a carpet remnant with a trouble light, ear defenders and an assortment of bucking bars on her tummy. We made great progress rivetting on the turtledeck until her Mom discovered Vanessa's bed was empty at 2300 on a school night and shut us down. They, along with younger daughters, Elisabeth and Samantha, completely covered the fuselage in Sharpie-pen art, some of it quite touching, most of it gross. There was so many hangings, stabbings, vomitting,flatulence, and toilet humour that I started to worry I'd failed as a father.When I peeled the plastic off, I saved some of it for the shop walls. All four tried not to make me feel guitly as they individually trekked through the darkness and puddles to the shop for help with their homework or to wish me a good night. In appreciation of their help and recognition of the price they, too, paid, the registration is C-GSEV. And last, but certainly not the least, is my long-suffering better-half, Jaye. We met when I was finishing my first homebuilt, a Pitts S1, so she's no stranger to airplane parts in the dining room and behind the living-room couch, plans on the night table and parts catalogues beside the tub. Despite having a big family to raise and a big home to look after, she always dropped whatever she was doing to appear in the shop within minutes of a call for another pair of hands. And,as I control in income and she looks after the outgo, Jaye always managed to find the money for the seemingly-endless stream of four-figure purchases aircraft require. The children all seem to have clothes and shoes. They don't look malnourished. I'm not really sure I WANT to know how she did it. My biulding experience was quite a journey of discovery. In the beginning, way back at drilling the aluminum straps to the horizontal stabilizer rear spar, I was so worried about wrecking it. My learning curve wasn't a curve at all, it was a vertical line. But, confidence comes fast. By the end, I felt like there wasn't any problem I could not solve or screwup I could not fix. The three biggest that come to mind are closing the garage door on an aileron (oh well, I wasn't too happy with it anyways) rivetting the gearleg fairing hinges to the engine cowling halves and not discovering the error until, having spent half a day looking for the hinges and always coming across heavier hinge of the correct length, the light went on; and cutting away the aft fuselage side skin on the wrong side of a stringer. I still can't believe I did that. Cars fit back in the garage. The outside of the house and the yard are slowly having less of a depressing effect upon local real-estate values. Our twenty-four year-old beater of a Suburban labours out to the old, WWII hangar at Boundary Bay laden with flying kit, tools, parts, plans and an air compressor. And everytime I walk into that hangar with a list of adjustments to make and a couple pf minor snags to tend to, I see this creation poised there on its swept-back gear, looking like it's going transonic just at rest, resplendent-no, glowing- in white-and-red Imron paint with sixtie's-era, RCAF Tutor markings. The big, red spinner points up with attitude as if sniffing the air before leaping into it. And I invariably think-Hell, I'll work on it later. Let's throw the 'chute and helmet into it, push it out and call for the fuel bowser. It's easier than I thought to overlook all the paint runs, smiles and dings, chewed up screw heads and waves in the skin panels. Oh yeah-you're probably wondering why I'm disappointed. Well, I didn't get "The Grin." When the prop stopped and I rolled the canopy back and raised my visor, my expression could best be described as stunned. I was astonished that it actually worked, Everything worked, from the homemade annunciator panel, the WAG of offset for the vertical stab to the dual-throttle system I dreamed up. The full-size B8 stick grips from Wicks and the mil-surplus F-86 throttle grip feel so good I'm reluctant to let go to adjust the DG, altimeter or comm. So, it's been said before-and I've looked forward to saying this-but, keep pounding those rivets! I know at times it seems like it will never be finished, especially towards the end; and air tools seems to be lubricated with blood, sweat and tears. I know it seems to gobble money as fast as Froot Loops disappear into a teenager's mouth. Trust me, you will not be disappointed. It will be worth it. Oh, man, is it worth it! Say, I think I feel a grin comin' on...... Scott in Vancouver pictures just uploaded to matronics. com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020914/4d7e06f6/attachment.htm From jjewell at telus.net Sat Sep 14 11:42:57 2002 From: jjewell at telus.net (Jim Jewell) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) References: <002b01c25c04$566e77e0$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <004401c25c1e$8b8f6500$d5d6b742@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hi Scott and Jaye, You folks must be Soooo! happy! Congadulations!! I cannot yet picture my shop downstairs with cars in it. I can see lots of small RV upgrade and mod sessions but it just won't be the same. An RV 10??!!! Hmmm? SMACK! POW!... OW! stop it woman!! Thump Bang POW OUCH!... i was only kidding poopsy dear. (:-)! Great flights, greased landings, Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaye and Scott Jackson To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Saturday, September 14, 2002 8:35 AM Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaye and Scott Jackson To: rv-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 10:45 PM Subject: First Flight! (Long) After six-and-a-half years of winter-time building, two moves, one-and-a-half years in storage,about fifty-thousand Canadian dollars( about 450USD), and several final hours spent working up normal and emergency checklists and practicing a bailout routine-I made the canopy jettisonable: I am both pleased( strike that, Moneypenny; make that thrilled) as well as disappointed to announce that RV-6 #24613 has left the nest as of 16Aug02. Into a light wind, the Imitutor surged down the runway and leapt into the clear, evening sky, giving real meaning to the word airBORNE for me. For fourty minutes, while being put through the manoeuvres recommended in "Flight Testing Homebuilt Aircraft", we scribed gentle circles over the tidal flats downwind of the into-wind runway as I became acquainted with the vibration and control feel during clean and partial-flap turns and stalls. A pratice go-around was followed by a surprisingly gentle touchdown and straighforward rollout. Sitting on a piece of foamy cut from the kids' sleeping bag underlay-which they haven't yet discovered, I felt trussed like a Christmas turkey in Nomex suit and gloves, leather boots, life vest( the runway ends at the dike holding back the Pacific Ocean),parachute and an old, Gentex helmet on which I kept the tinted visor down; ostensibly to give additional protection from a birstrike with one of the steady streams of seagulls returning to the ocean from the city dump after supper; but actually so no one could see I needed my half-frame glasses just to see the instruments. The workshop is now cold, dark and quiet. The silhouette of the fuselage is faintly visible on the floor, outlined by paint overspray. You'd have to look through the layer of drilled-off rivet heads and punched-out tails, sharp little coils of aluminum looking like shiny curly fries, short lengths of wiring insulation, heatshrink and plastic tubing that look enough like macaroni to keep fooling our terrier, fine aluminum powder from the Scotchbrite wheel and white curlies and powder from cutting and fitting the canopy, brown stripes of masking tape and the twin, green stripes of rivetting tape. I know it wouldn't hurt to look around for the broom, but I felt the shop had atmosphere. I'd like to personally thank the wise people who invented plastic-covered aluminum sheet, oops rivets, blind rivets, brad-point drills, rivet-spacing fans, Unibits, HVLP and Scotchbrite wheels. Also those patient folk on this list who take the time to explain the stupidest questions for the rest of us. And controller Rick, who graciously sent all other traffic at Canada's third-busiest airport to the crosswind runway and kept them all away from me. On the other hand, if I ever come across the masochists who thought up Proseal, fibreglass, Phillips-head screws or fly cutters...... To list the people instrumental in this experience, I would have to start with Peter Jarman. This is all his fault for giving me a key to his 180hp RV-4 after I helped him wire and finish it. It only took a few flights before I had a serious case of," I want one!" He loaned me all his building tools over half-a decade ago, and made numerous, hour-long trips to the shop on his unmuffled Harley. The neighbours must've thought we were drug dealers. He phoned frequently, not even saying Hi, just starting with,"What are you doing on your airplane today?" Whenver he sensed I was flagging, we would go somewhere in his -4. Coming from a military family, I respond best to butt-kicking, and he's verbally kicked mine for six years. Thanks, Peter. Sorry about breaking the trigger off your rivet gun. Many others also helped and the wall by the shop phone is covered with their phone nuimbers. Jim Asprey was our inspector as well as building his own -6. He eased the pain of the mandatory $642 fee for the final inspection by spending over four hours on, in and under it so I at least felt like I was getting something for the money. Brian Carr has built seven of these and had an answer for every dumb question.Milt Sadoway would interrupt buidling his Rocket whenever I needed help. Tedd McHenry skipped supper on short notice to act as follow-on vehicle on the move to the airport. August P. was kind enough to let me abuse his -6 in a rehearsal of the test flight and several circuits just hours before it happened for real. Oldest child, and our only son, Gregory, helped rivet the empennage but discovered girls when the wings arrived. Oldest daughter Vanessa, who can't wait to learn to fly, spent one evening in the tailcone lying on a carpet remnant with a trouble light, ear defenders and an assortment of bucking bars on her tummy. We made great progress rivetting on the turtledeck until her Mom discovered Vanessa's bed was empty at 2300 on a school night and shut us down. They, along with younger daughters, Elisabeth and Samantha, completely covered the fuselage in Sharpie-pen art, some of it quite touching, most of it gross. There was so many hangings, stabbings, vomitting,flatulence, and toilet humour that I started to worry I'd failed as a father.When I peeled the plastic off, I saved some of it for the shop walls. All four tried not to make me feel guitly as they individually trekked through the darkness and puddles to the shop for help with their homework or to wish me a good night. In appreciation of their help and recognition of the price they, too, paid, the registration is C-GSEV. And last, but certainly not the least, is my long-suffering better-half, Jaye. We met when I was finishing my first homebuilt, a Pitts S1, so she's no stranger to airplane parts in the dining room and behind the living-room couch, plans on the night table and parts catalogues beside the tub. Despite having a big family to raise and a big home to look after, she always dropped whatever she was doing to appear in the shop within minutes of a call for another pair of hands. And,as I control in income and she looks after the outgo, Jaye always managed to find the money for the seemingly-endless stream of four-figure purchases aircraft require. The children all seem to have clothes and shoes. They don't look malnourished. I'm not really sure I WANT to know how she did it. My biulding experience was quite a journey of discovery. In the beginning, way back at drilling the aluminum straps to the horizontal stabilizer rear spar, I was so worried about wrecking it. My learning curve wasn't a curve at all, it was a vertical line. But, confidence comes fast. By the end, I felt like there wasn't any problem I could not solve or screwup I could not fix. The three biggest that come to mind are closing the garage door on an aileron (oh well, I wasn't too happy with it anyways) rivetting the gearleg fairing hinges to the engine cowling halves and not discovering the error until, having spent half a day looking for the hinges and always coming across heavier hinge of the correct length, the light went on; and cutting away the aft fuselage side skin on the wrong side of a stringer. I still can't believe I did that. Cars fit back in the garage. The outside of the house and the yard are slowly having less of a depressing effect upon local real-estate values. Our twenty-four year-old beater of a Suburban labours out to the old, WWII hangar at Boundary Bay laden with flying kit, tools, parts, plans and an air compressor. And everytime I walk into that hangar with a list of adjustments to make and a couple pf minor snags to tend to, I see this creation poised there on its swept-back gear, looking like it's going transonic just at rest, resplendent-no, glowing- in white-and-red Imron paint with sixtie's-era, RCAF Tutor markings. The big, red spinner points up with attitude as if sniffing the air before leaping into it. And I invariably think-Hell, I'll work on it later. Let's throw the 'chute and helmet into it, push it out and call for the fuel bowser. It's easier than I thought to overlook all the paint runs, smiles and dings, chewed up screw heads and waves in the skin panels. Oh yeah-you're probably wondering why I'm disappointed. Well, I didn't get "The Grin." When the prop stopped and I rolled the canopy back and raised my visor, my expression could best be described as stunned. I was astonished that it actually worked, Everything worked, from the homemade annunciator panel, the WAG of offset for the vertical stab to the dual-throttle system I dreamed up. The full-size B8 stick grips from Wicks and the mil-surplus F-86 throttle grip feel so good I'm reluctant to let go to adjust the DG, altimeter or comm. So, it's been said before-and I've looked forward to saying this-but, keep pounding those rivets! I know at times it seems like it will never be finished, especially towards the end; and air tools seems to be lubricated with blood, sweat and tears. I know it seems to gobble money as fast as Froot Loops disappear into a teenager's mouth. Trust me, you will not be disappointed. It will be worth it. Oh, man, is it worth it! Say, I think I feel a grin comin' on...... Scott in Vancouver pictures just uploaded to matronics. com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020914/f9402ade/attachment.htm From patman at itdoesntsuck.com Sat Sep 14 12:54:28 2002 From: patman at itdoesntsuck.com (Pat Dayman) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) In-Reply-To: <002b01c25c04$566e77e0$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.1.20020914155326.00bb2130@mail.earthlink.net> Congratulations, I am sure it will exceed all of your expectations. Pat Dayman (jr) At 08:35 AM 9/14/2002 -0700, you wrote: > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Jaye and Scott Jackson >To: rv-list@matronics.com >Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 10:45 PM >Subject: First Flight! (Long) > >After six-and-a-half years of winter-time building, two moves, >one-and-a-half years in storage,about fifty-thousand Canadian dollars( >about 450USD), and several final hours spent working up normal and >emergency checklists and practicing a bailout routine-I made the canopy >jettisonable: > I am both pleased( strike that, Moneypenny; make that thrilled) as well > as disappointed to announce that RV-6 #24613 has left the nest as of 16Aug02. > >Into a light wind, the Imitutor surged down the runway and leapt into the >clear, evening sky, giving real meaning to the word airBORNE for me. For >fourty minutes, while being put through the manoeuvres recommended in >"Flight Testing Homebuilt Aircraft", we scribed gentle circles over the >tidal flats downwind of the into-wind runway as I became acquainted with >the vibration and control feel during clean and partial-flap turns and >stalls. A pratice go-around was followed by a surprisingly gentle >touchdown and straighforward rollout. > >Sitting on a piece of foamy cut from the kids' sleeping bag underlay-which >they haven't yet discovered, I felt trussed like a Christmas turkey in >Nomex suit and gloves, leather boots, life vest( the runway ends at the >dike holding back the Pacific Ocean),parachute and an old, Gentex helmet >on which I kept the tinted visor down; ostensibly to give additional >protection from a birstrike with one of the steady streams of seagulls >returning to the ocean from the city dump after supper; but actually so no >one could see I needed my half-frame glasses just to see the instruments. > >The workshop is now cold, dark and quiet. The silhouette of the fuselage >is faintly visible on the floor, outlined by paint overspray. You'd have >to look through the layer of drilled-off rivet heads and punched-out >tails, sharp little coils of aluminum looking like shiny curly fries, >short lengths of wiring insulation, heatshrink and plastic tubing that >look enough like macaroni to keep fooling our terrier, fine aluminum >powder from the Scotchbrite wheel and white curlies and powder from >cutting and fitting the canopy, brown stripes of masking tape and the >twin, green stripes of rivetting tape. I know it wouldn't hurt to look >around for the broom, but I felt the shop had atmosphere. > >I'd like to personally thank the wise people who invented plastic-covered >aluminum sheet, oops rivets, blind rivets, brad-point drills, >rivet-spacing fans, Unibits, HVLP and Scotchbrite wheels. Also those >patient folk on this list who take the time to explain the stupidest >questions for the rest of us. And controller Rick, who graciously sent all >other traffic at Canada's third-busiest airport to the crosswind runway >and kept them all away from me. > >On the other hand, if I ever come across the masochists who thought up >Proseal, fibreglass, Phillips-head screws or fly cutters...... > >To list the people instrumental in this experience, I would have to start >with Peter Jarman. This is all his fault for giving me a key to his 180hp >RV-4 after I helped him wire and finish it. It only took a few flights >before I had a serious case of," I want one!" He loaned me all his >building tools over half-a decade ago, and made numerous, hour-long trips >to the shop on his unmuffled Harley. The neighbours must've thought we >were drug dealers. He phoned frequently, not even saying Hi, just starting >with,"What are you doing on your airplane today?" Whenver he sensed I was >flagging, we would go somewhere in his -4. Coming from a military family, >I respond best to butt-kicking, and he's verbally kicked mine for six >years. Thanks, Peter. Sorry about breaking the trigger off your rivet gun. > >Many others also helped and the wall by the shop phone is covered with >their phone nuimbers. Jim Asprey was our inspector as well as building >his own -6. He eased the pain of the mandatory $642 fee for the final >inspection by spending over four hours on, in and under it so I at least >felt like I was getting something for the money. Brian Carr has built >seven of these and had an answer for every dumb question.Milt Sadoway >would interrupt buidling his Rocket whenever I needed help. Tedd McHenry >skipped supper on short notice to act as follow-on vehicle on the move to >the airport. August P. was kind enough to let me abuse his -6 in a >rehearsal of the test flight and several circuits just hours before it >happened for real. > >Oldest child, and our only son, Gregory, helped rivet the empennage but >discovered girls when the wings arrived. Oldest daughter Vanessa, who >can't wait to learn to fly, spent one evening in the tailcone lying on a >carpet remnant with a trouble light, ear defenders and an assortment of >bucking bars on her tummy. We made great progress rivetting on the >turtledeck until her Mom discovered Vanessa's bed was empty at 2300 on a >school night and shut us down. > >They, along with younger daughters, Elisabeth and Samantha, completely >covered the fuselage in Sharpie-pen art, some of it quite touching, most >of it gross. There was so many hangings, >stabbings, vomitting,flatulence, and toilet humour that I started to >worry I'd failed as a father.When I peeled the plastic off, I saved some >of it for the shop walls. All four tried not to make me feel guitly as >they individually trekked through the darkness and puddles to the shop for >help with their homework or to wish me a good night. In appreciation of >their help and recognition of the price they, too, paid, the registration >is C-GSEV. > >And last, but certainly not the least, is my long-suffering better-half, >Jaye. We met when I was finishing my first homebuilt, a Pitts S1, so she's >no stranger to airplane parts in the dining room and behind the >living-room couch, plans on the night table and parts catalogues beside >the tub. Despite having a big family to raise and a big home to look >after, she always dropped whatever she was doing to appear in the shop >within minutes of a call for another pair of hands. And,as I control in >income and she looks after the outgo, Jaye always managed to find the >money for the seemingly-endless stream of four-figure purchases aircraft >require. The children all seem to have clothes and shoes. They don't look >malnourished. I'm not really sure I WANT to know how she did it. > > >My biulding experience was quite a journey of discovery. In the beginning, >way back at drilling the aluminum straps to the horizontal stabilizer rear >spar, I was so worried about wrecking it. My learning curve wasn't a curve >at all, it was a vertical line. But, confidence comes fast. By the end, I >felt like there wasn't any problem I could not solve or screwup I could >not fix. The three biggest that come to mind are closing the garage door >on an aileron (oh well, I wasn't too happy with it anyways) rivetting the >gearleg fairing hinges to the engine cowling halves and not discovering >the error until, having spent half a day looking for the hinges and always >coming across heavier hinge of the correct length, the light went on; and >cutting away the aft fuselage side skin on the wrong side of a stringer. I >still can't believe I did that. > >Cars fit back in the garage. The outside of the house and the yard are >slowly having less of a depressing effect upon local real-estate values. >Our twenty-four year-old beater of a Suburban labours out to the old, WWII >hangar at Boundary Bay laden with flying kit, tools, parts, plans and an >air compressor. > >And everytime I walk into that hangar with a list of adjustments to make >and a couple pf minor snags to tend to, I see this creation poised there >on its swept-back gear, looking like it's going transonic just at rest, >resplendent-no, glowing- in white-and-red Imron paint with sixtie's-era, >RCAF Tutor markings. The big, red spinner points up with attitude as if >sniffing the air before leaping into it. And I invariably think-Hell, I'll >work on it later. Let's throw the 'chute and helmet into it, push it out >and call for the fuel bowser. It's easier than I thought to overlook all >the paint runs, smiles and dings, chewed up screw heads and waves in the >skin panels. > >Oh yeah-you're probably wondering why I'm disappointed. Well, I didn't >get "The Grin." When the prop stopped and I rolled the canopy back and >raised my visor, my expression could best be described as stunned. I was >astonished that it actually worked, Everything worked, from the homemade >annunciator panel, the WAG of offset for the vertical stab to the >dual-throttle system I dreamed up. The full-size B8 stick grips from Wicks >and the mil-surplus F-86 throttle grip feel so good I'm reluctant to let >go to adjust the DG, altimeter or comm. > >So, it's been said before-and I've looked forward to saying this-but, keep >pounding those rivets! I know at times it seems like it will never be >finished, especially towards the end; and air tools seems to be lubricated >with blood, sweat and tears. I know it seems to gobble money as fast as >Froot Loops disappear into a teenager's mouth. Trust me, you will not be >disappointed. It will be worth it. Oh, man, is it worth it! > >Say, I think I feel a grin comin' on...... > >Scott in Vancouver >pictures just uploaded to matronics. com From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Sat Sep 14 21:32:36 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) References: <5.1.0.14.1.20020914155326.00bb2130@mail.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <006d01c25c70$eac0ed80$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> What's happening re the brakes? ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pat Dayman" To: Sent: Saturday, September 14, 2002 12:54 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) > Congratulations, > > I am sure it will exceed all of your expectations. > > Pat Dayman > (jr) > > > > At 08:35 AM 9/14/2002 -0700, you wrote: > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: Jaye and Scott Jackson > >To: rv-list@matronics.com > >Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 10:45 PM > >Subject: First Flight! (Long) > > > >After six-and-a-half years of winter-time building, two moves, > >one-and-a-half years in storage,about fifty-thousand Canadian dollars( > >about 450USD), and several final hours spent working up normal and > >emergency checklists and practicing a bailout routine-I made the canopy > >jettisonable: > > I am both pleased( strike that, Moneypenny; make that thrilled) as well > > as disappointed to announce that RV-6 #24613 has left the nest as of 16Aug02. > > > >Into a light wind, the Imitutor surged down the runway and leapt into the > >clear, evening sky, giving real meaning to the word airBORNE for me. For > >fourty minutes, while being put through the manoeuvres recommended in > >"Flight Testing Homebuilt Aircraft", we scribed gentle circles over the > >tidal flats downwind of the into-wind runway as I became acquainted with > >the vibration and control feel during clean and partial-flap turns and > >stalls. A pratice go-around was followed by a surprisingly gentle > >touchdown and straighforward rollout. > > > >Sitting on a piece of foamy cut from the kids' sleeping bag underlay-which > >they haven't yet discovered, I felt trussed like a Christmas turkey in > >Nomex suit and gloves, leather boots, life vest( the runway ends at the > >dike holding back the Pacific Ocean),parachute and an old, Gentex helmet > >on which I kept the tinted visor down; ostensibly to give additional > >protection from a birstrike with one of the steady streams of seagulls > >returning to the ocean from the city dump after supper; but actually so no > >one could see I needed my half-frame glasses just to see the instruments. > > > >The workshop is now cold, dark and quiet. The silhouette of the fuselage > >is faintly visible on the floor, outlined by paint overspray. You'd have > >to look through the layer of drilled-off rivet heads and punched-out > >tails, sharp little coils of aluminum looking like shiny curly fries, > >short lengths of wiring insulation, heatshrink and plastic tubing that > >look enough like macaroni to keep fooling our terrier, fine aluminum > >powder from the Scotchbrite wheel and white curlies and powder from > >cutting and fitting the canopy, brown stripes of masking tape and the > >twin, green stripes of rivetting tape. I know it wouldn't hurt to look > >around for the broom, but I felt the shop had atmosphere. > > > >I'd like to personally thank the wise people who invented plastic-covered > >aluminum sheet, oops rivets, blind rivets, brad-point drills, > >rivet-spacing fans, Unibits, HVLP and Scotchbrite wheels. Also those > >patient folk on this list who take the time to explain the stupidest > >questions for the rest of us. And controller Rick, who graciously sent all > >other traffic at Canada's third-busiest airport to the crosswind runway > >and kept them all away from me. > > > >On the other hand, if I ever come across the masochists who thought up > >Proseal, fibreglass, Phillips-head screws or fly cutters...... > > > >To list the people instrumental in this experience, I would have to start > >with Peter Jarman. This is all his fault for giving me a key to his 180hp > >RV-4 after I helped him wire and finish it. It only took a few flights > >before I had a serious case of," I want one!" He loaned me all his > >building tools over half-a decade ago, and made numerous, hour-long trips > >to the shop on his unmuffled Harley. The neighbours must've thought we > >were drug dealers. He phoned frequently, not even saying Hi, just starting > >with,"What are you doing on your airplane today?" Whenver he sensed I was > >flagging, we would go somewhere in his -4. Coming from a military family, > >I respond best to butt-kicking, and he's verbally kicked mine for six > >years. Thanks, Peter. Sorry about breaking the trigger off your rivet gun. > > > >Many others also helped and the wall by the shop phone is covered with > >their phone nuimbers. Jim Asprey was our inspector as well as building > >his own -6. He eased the pain of the mandatory $642 fee for the final > >inspection by spending over four hours on, in and under it so I at least > >felt like I was getting something for the money. Brian Carr has built > >seven of these and had an answer for every dumb question.Milt Sadoway > >would interrupt buidling his Rocket whenever I needed help. Tedd McHenry > >skipped supper on short notice to act as follow-on vehicle on the move to > >the airport. August P. was kind enough to let me abuse his -6 in a > >rehearsal of the test flight and several circuits just hours before it > >happened for real. > > > >Oldest child, and our only son, Gregory, helped rivet the empennage but > >discovered girls when the wings arrived. Oldest daughter Vanessa, who > >can't wait to learn to fly, spent one evening in the tailcone lying on a > >carpet remnant with a trouble light, ear defenders and an assortment of > >bucking bars on her tummy. We made great progress rivetting on the > >turtledeck until her Mom discovered Vanessa's bed was empty at 2300 on a > >school night and shut us down. > > > >They, along with younger daughters, Elisabeth and Samantha, completely > >covered the fuselage in Sharpie-pen art, some of it quite touching, most > >of it gross. There was so many hangings, > >stabbings, vomitting,flatulence, and toilet humour that I started to > >worry I'd failed as a father.When I peeled the plastic off, I saved some > >of it for the shop walls. All four tried not to make me feel guitly as > >they individually trekked through the darkness and puddles to the shop for > >help with their homework or to wish me a good night. In appreciation of > >their help and recognition of the price they, too, paid, the registration > >is C-GSEV. > > > >And last, but certainly not the least, is my long-suffering better-half, > >Jaye. We met when I was finishing my first homebuilt, a Pitts S1, so she's > >no stranger to airplane parts in the dining room and behind the > >living-room couch, plans on the night table and parts catalogues beside > >the tub. Despite having a big family to raise and a big home to look > >after, she always dropped whatever she was doing to appear in the shop > >within minutes of a call for another pair of hands. And,as I control in > >income and she looks after the outgo, Jaye always managed to find the > >money for the seemingly-endless stream of four-figure purchases aircraft > >require. The children all seem to have clothes and shoes. They don't look > >malnourished. I'm not really sure I WANT to know how she did it. > > > > > >My biulding experience was quite a journey of discovery. In the beginning, > >way back at drilling the aluminum straps to the horizontal stabilizer rear > >spar, I was so worried about wrecking it. My learning curve wasn't a curve > >at all, it was a vertical line. But, confidence comes fast. By the end, I > >felt like there wasn't any problem I could not solve or screwup I could > >not fix. The three biggest that come to mind are closing the garage door > >on an aileron (oh well, I wasn't too happy with it anyways) rivetting the > >gearleg fairing hinges to the engine cowling halves and not discovering > >the error until, having spent half a day looking for the hinges and always > >coming across heavier hinge of the correct length, the light went on; and > >cutting away the aft fuselage side skin on the wrong side of a stringer. I > >still can't believe I did that. > > > >Cars fit back in the garage. The outside of the house and the yard are > >slowly having less of a depressing effect upon local real-estate values. > >Our twenty-four year-old beater of a Suburban labours out to the old, WWII > >hangar at Boundary Bay laden with flying kit, tools, parts, plans and an > >air compressor. > > > >And everytime I walk into that hangar with a list of adjustments to make > >and a couple pf minor snags to tend to, I see this creation poised there > >on its swept-back gear, looking like it's going transonic just at rest, > >resplendent-no, glowing- in white-and-red Imron paint with sixtie's-era, > >RCAF Tutor markings. The big, red spinner points up with attitude as if > >sniffing the air before leaping into it. And I invariably think-Hell, I'll > >work on it later. Let's throw the 'chute and helmet into it, push it out > >and call for the fuel bowser. It's easier than I thought to overlook all > >the paint runs, smiles and dings, chewed up screw heads and waves in the > >skin panels. > > > >Oh yeah-you're probably wondering why I'm disappointed. Well, I didn't > >get "The Grin." When the prop stopped and I rolled the canopy back and > >raised my visor, my expression could best be described as stunned. I was > >astonished that it actually worked, Everything worked, from the homemade > >annunciator panel, the WAG of offset for the vertical stab to the > >dual-throttle system I dreamed up. The full-size B8 stick grips from Wicks > >and the mil-surplus F-86 throttle grip feel so good I'm reluctant to let > >go to adjust the DG, altimeter or comm. > > > >So, it's been said before-and I've looked forward to saying this-but, keep > >pounding those rivets! I know at times it seems like it will never be > >finished, especially towards the end; and air tools seems to be lubricated > >with blood, sweat and tears. I know it seems to gobble money as fast as > >Froot Loops disappear into a teenager's mouth. Trust me, you will not be > >disappointed. It will be worth it. Oh, man, is it worth it! > > > >Say, I think I feel a grin comin' on...... > > > >Scott in Vancouver > >pictures just uploaded to matronics. com > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tlaw at klondiker.com Sun Sep 15 08:34:48 2002 From: tlaw at klondiker.com (Tom and Marilyn Law) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) References: <002b01c25c04$566e77e0$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <000f01c25ccd$6dfc5660$3feff7c7@whtvcable.com> Congratulations, I feel inspired to get out there and get pounding rivets.... Tom in Whitehorse ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaye and Scott Jackson To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Saturday, September 14, 2002 8:35 AM Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaye and Scott Jackson To: rv-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 10:45 PM Subject: First Flight! (Long) After six-and-a-half years of winter-time building, two moves, one-and-a-half years in storage,about fifty-thousand Canadian dollars( about 450USD), and several final hours spent working up normal and emergency checklists and practicing a bailout routine-I made the canopy jettisonable: I am both pleased( strike that, Moneypenny; make that thrilled) as well as disappointed to announce that RV-6 #24613 has left the nest as of 16Aug02. Into a light wind, the Imitutor surged down the runway and leapt into the clear, evening sky, giving real meaning to the word airBORNE for me. For fourty minutes, while being put through the manoeuvres recommended in "Flight Testing Homebuilt Aircraft", we scribed gentle circles over the tidal flats downwind of the into-wind runway as I became acquainted with the vibration and control feel during clean and partial-flap turns and stalls. A pratice go-around was followed by a surprisingly gentle touchdown and straighforward rollout. Sitting on a piece of foamy cut from the kids' sleeping bag underlay-which they haven't yet discovered, I felt trussed like a Christmas turkey in Nomex suit and gloves, leather boots, life vest( the runway ends at the dike holding back the Pacific Ocean),parachute and an old, Gentex helmet on which I kept the tinted visor down; ostensibly to give additional protection from a birstrike with one of the steady streams of seagulls returning to the ocean from the city dump after supper; but actually so no one could see I needed my half-frame glasses just to see the instruments. The workshop is now cold, dark and quiet. The silhouette of the fuselage is faintly visible on the floor, outlined by paint overspray. You'd have to look through the layer of drilled-off rivet heads and punched-out tails, sharp little coils of aluminum looking like shiny curly fries, short lengths of wiring insulation, heatshrink and plastic tubing that look enough like macaroni to keep fooling our terrier, fine aluminum powder from the Scotchbrite wheel and white curlies and powder from cutting and fitting the canopy, brown stripes of masking tape and the twin, green stripes of rivetting tape. I know it wouldn't hurt to look around for the broom, but I felt the shop had atmosphere. I'd like to personally thank the wise people who invented plastic-covered aluminum sheet, oops rivets, blind rivets, brad-point drills, rivet-spacing fans, Unibits, HVLP and Scotchbrite wheels. Also those patient folk on this list who take the time to explain the stupidest questions for the rest of us. And controller Rick, who graciously sent all other traffic at Canada's third-busiest airport to the crosswind runway and kept them all away from me. On the other hand, if I ever come across the masochists who thought up Proseal, fibreglass, Phillips-head screws or fly cutters...... To list the people instrumental in this experience, I would have to start with Peter Jarman. This is all his fault for giving me a key to his 180hp RV-4 after I helped him wire and finish it. It only took a few flights before I had a serious case of," I want one!" He loaned me all his building tools over half-a decade ago, and made numerous, hour-long trips to the shop on his unmuffled Harley. The neighbours must've thought we were drug dealers. He phoned frequently, not even saying Hi, just starting with,"What are you doing on your airplane today?" Whenver he sensed I was flagging, we would go somewhere in his -4. Coming from a military family, I respond best to butt-kicking, and he's verbally kicked mine for six years. Thanks, Peter. Sorry about breaking the trigger off your rivet gun. Many others also helped and the wall by the shop phone is covered with their phone nuimbers. Jim Asprey was our inspector as well as building his own -6. He eased the pain of the mandatory $642 fee for the final inspection by spending over four hours on, in and under it so I at least felt like I was getting something for the money. Brian Carr has built seven of these and had an answer for every dumb question.Milt Sadoway would interrupt buidling his Rocket whenever I needed help. Tedd McHenry skipped supper on short notice to act as follow-on vehicle on the move to the airport. August P. was kind enough to let me abuse his -6 in a rehearsal of the test flight and several circuits just hours before it happened for real. Oldest child, and our only son, Gregory, helped rivet the empennage but discovered girls when the wings arrived. Oldest daughter Vanessa, who can't wait to learn to fly, spent one evening in the tailcone lying on a carpet remnant with a trouble light, ear defenders and an assortment of bucking bars on her tummy. We made great progress rivetting on the turtledeck until her Mom discovered Vanessa's bed was empty at 2300 on a school night and shut us down. They, along with younger daughters, Elisabeth and Samantha, completely covered the fuselage in Sharpie-pen art, some of it quite touching, most of it gross. There was so many hangings, stabbings, vomitting,flatulence, and toilet humour that I started to worry I'd failed as a father.When I peeled the plastic off, I saved some of it for the shop walls. All four tried not to make me feel guitly as they individually trekked through the darkness and puddles to the shop for help with their homework or to wish me a good night. In appreciation of their help and recognition of the price they, too, paid, the registration is C-GSEV. And last, but certainly not the least, is my long-suffering better-half, Jaye. We met when I was finishing my first homebuilt, a Pitts S1, so she's no stranger to airplane parts in the dining room and behind the living-room couch, plans on the night table and parts catalogues beside the tub. Despite having a big family to raise and a big home to look after, she always dropped whatever she was doing to appear in the shop within minutes of a call for another pair of hands. And,as I control in income and she looks after the outgo, Jaye always managed to find the money for the seemingly-endless stream of four-figure purchases aircraft require. The children all seem to have clothes and shoes. They don't look malnourished. I'm not really sure I WANT to know how she did it. My biulding experience was quite a journey of discovery. In the beginning, way back at drilling the aluminum straps to the horizontal stabilizer rear spar, I was so worried about wrecking it. My learning curve wasn't a curve at all, it was a vertical line. But, confidence comes fast. By the end, I felt like there wasn't any problem I could not solve or screwup I could not fix. The three biggest that come to mind are closing the garage door on an aileron (oh well, I wasn't too happy with it anyways) rivetting the gearleg fairing hinges to the engine cowling halves and not discovering the error until, having spent half a day looking for the hinges and always coming across heavier hinge of the correct length, the light went on; and cutting away the aft fuselage side skin on the wrong side of a stringer. I still can't believe I did that. Cars fit back in the garage. The outside of the house and the yard are slowly having less of a depressing effect upon local real-estate values. Our twenty-four year-old beater of a Suburban labours out to the old, WWII hangar at Boundary Bay laden with flying kit, tools, parts, plans and an air compressor. And everytime I walk into that hangar with a list of adjustments to make and a couple pf minor snags to tend to, I see this creation poised there on its swept-back gear, looking like it's going transonic just at rest, resplendent-no, glowing- in white-and-red Imron paint with sixtie's-era, RCAF Tutor markings. The big, red spinner points up with attitude as if sniffing the air before leaping into it. And I invariably think-Hell, I'll work on it later. Let's throw the 'chute and helmet into it, push it out and call for the fuel bowser. It's easier than I thought to overlook all the paint runs, smiles and dings, chewed up screw heads and waves in the skin panels. Oh yeah-you're probably wondering why I'm disappointed. Well, I didn't get "The Grin." When the prop stopped and I rolled the canopy back and raised my visor, my expression could best be described as stunned. I was astonished that it actually worked, Everything worked, from the homemade annunciator panel, the WAG of offset for the vertical stab to the dual-throttle system I dreamed up. The full-size B8 stick grips from Wicks and the mil-surplus F-86 throttle grip feel so good I'm reluctant to let go to adjust the DG, altimeter or comm. So, it's been said before-and I've looked forward to saying this-but, keep pounding those rivets! I know at times it seems like it will never be finished, especially towards the end; and air tools seems to be lubricated with blood, sweat and tears. I know it seems to gobble money as fast as Froot Loops disappear into a teenager's mouth. Trust me, you will not be disappointed. It will be worth it. Oh, man, is it worth it! Say, I think I feel a grin comin' on...... Scott in Vancouver pictures just uploaded to matronics. com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020915/45ef0289/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon Sep 16 20:28:11 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Oshkosh Diary Message-ID: Hammy McClymont sent me a gentle reminder today that I had not yet posted his Oshkosh Diary - 2002 to the Wing web site. Hammy's your excellent article is now on the web site, linked from the front page (www.vansairforce.org). Sorry for the delay, Hammy. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From mdeg at shaw.ca Tue Sep 17 13:29:33 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) References: <002b01c25c04$566e77e0$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <003601c25e88$ef0c0220$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Scott, congratulations on the first flight....!! the grin doesn't go away..... Marc DeGirolamo C-FRVE.....75 hrs..... ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaye and Scott Jackson To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Saturday, September 14, 2002 9:35 AM Subject: [Wing] Fw: First Flight! (Long) ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaye and Scott Jackson To: rv-list@matronics.com Sent: Friday, September 13, 2002 10:45 PM Subject: First Flight! (Long) After six-and-a-half years of winter-time building, two moves, one-and-a-half years in storage,about fifty-thousand Canadian dollars( about 450USD), and several final hours spent working up normal and emergency checklists and practicing a bailout routine-I made the canopy jettisonable: I am both pleased( strike that, Moneypenny; make that thrilled) as well as disappointed to announce that RV-6 #24613 has left the nest as of 16Aug02. Into a light wind, the Imitutor surged down the runway and leapt into the clear, evening sky, giving real meaning to the word airBORNE for me. For fourty minutes, while being put through the manoeuvres recommended in "Flight Testing Homebuilt Aircraft", we scribed gentle circles over the tidal flats downwind of the into-wind runway as I became acquainted with the vibration and control feel during clean and partial-flap turns and stalls. A pratice go-around was followed by a surprisingly gentle touchdown and straighforward rollout. Sitting on a piece of foamy cut from the kids' sleeping bag underlay-which they haven't yet discovered, I felt trussed like a Christmas turkey in Nomex suit and gloves, leather boots, life vest( the runway ends at the dike holding back the Pacific Ocean),parachute and an old, Gentex helmet on which I kept the tinted visor down; ostensibly to give additional protection from a birstrike with one of the steady streams of seagulls returning to the ocean from the city dump after supper; but actually so no one could see I needed my half-frame glasses just to see the instruments. The workshop is now cold, dark and quiet. The silhouette of the fuselage is faintly visible on the floor, outlined by paint overspray. You'd have to look through the layer of drilled-off rivet heads and punched-out tails, sharp little coils of aluminum looking like shiny curly fries, short lengths of wiring insulation, heatshrink and plastic tubing that look enough like macaroni to keep fooling our terrier, fine aluminum powder from the Scotchbrite wheel and white curlies and powder from cutting and fitting the canopy, brown stripes of masking tape and the twin, green stripes of rivetting tape. I know it wouldn't hurt to look around for the broom, but I felt the shop had atmosphere. I'd like to personally thank the wise people who invented plastic-covered aluminum sheet, oops rivets, blind rivets, brad-point drills, rivet-spacing fans, Unibits, HVLP and Scotchbrite wheels. Also those patient folk on this list who take the time to explain the stupidest questions for the rest of us. And controller Rick, who graciously sent all other traffic at Canada's third-busiest airport to the crosswind runway and kept them all away from me. On the other hand, if I ever come across the masochists who thought up Proseal, fibreglass, Phillips-head screws or fly cutters...... To list the people instrumental in this experience, I would have to start with Peter Jarman. This is all his fault for giving me a key to his 180hp RV-4 after I helped him wire and finish it. It only took a few flights before I had a serious case of," I want one!" He loaned me all his building tools over half-a decade ago, and made numerous, hour-long trips to the shop on his unmuffled Harley. The neighbours must've thought we were drug dealers. He phoned frequently, not even saying Hi, just starting with,"What are you doing on your airplane today?" Whenver he sensed I was flagging, we would go somewhere in his -4. Coming from a military family, I respond best to butt-kicking, and he's verbally kicked mine for six years. Thanks, Peter. Sorry about breaking the trigger off your rivet gun. Many others also helped and the wall by the shop phone is covered with their phone nuimbers. Jim Asprey was our inspector as well as building his own -6. He eased the pain of the mandatory $642 fee for the final inspection by spending over four hours on, in and under it so I at least felt like I was getting something for the money. Brian Carr has built seven of these and had an answer for every dumb question.Milt Sadoway would interrupt buidling his Rocket whenever I needed help. Tedd McHenry skipped supper on short notice to act as follow-on vehicle on the move to the airport. August P. was kind enough to let me abuse his -6 in a rehearsal of the test flight and several circuits just hours before it happened for real. Oldest child, and our only son, Gregory, helped rivet the empennage but discovered girls when the wings arrived. Oldest daughter Vanessa, who can't wait to learn to fly, spent one evening in the tailcone lying on a carpet remnant with a trouble light, ear defenders and an assortment of bucking bars on her tummy. We made great progress rivetting on the turtledeck until her Mom discovered Vanessa's bed was empty at 2300 on a school night and shut us down. They, along with younger daughters, Elisabeth and Samantha, completely covered the fuselage in Sharpie-pen art, some of it quite touching, most of it gross. There was so many hangings, stabbings, vomitting,flatulence, and toilet humour that I started to worry I'd failed as a father.When I peeled the plastic off, I saved some of it for the shop walls. All four tried not to make me feel guitly as they individually trekked through the darkness and puddles to the shop for help with their homework or to wish me a good night. In appreciation of their help and recognition of the price they, too, paid, the registration is C-GSEV. And last, but certainly not the least, is my long-suffering better-half, Jaye. We met when I was finishing my first homebuilt, a Pitts S1, so she's no stranger to airplane parts in the dining room and behind the living-room couch, plans on the night table and parts catalogues beside the tub. Despite having a big family to raise and a big home to look after, she always dropped whatever she was doing to appear in the shop within minutes of a call for another pair of hands. And,as I control in income and she looks after the outgo, Jaye always managed to find the money for the seemingly-endless stream of four-figure purchases aircraft require. The children all seem to have clothes and shoes. They don't look malnourished. I'm not really sure I WANT to know how she did it. My biulding experience was quite a journey of discovery. In the beginning, way back at drilling the aluminum straps to the horizontal stabilizer rear spar, I was so worried about wrecking it. My learning curve wasn't a curve at all, it was a vertical line. But, confidence comes fast. By the end, I felt like there wasn't any problem I could not solve or screwup I could not fix. The three biggest that come to mind are closing the garage door on an aileron (oh well, I wasn't too happy with it anyways) rivetting the gearleg fairing hinges to the engine cowling halves and not discovering the error until, having spent half a day looking for the hinges and always coming across heavier hinge of the correct length, the light went on; and cutting away the aft fuselage side skin on the wrong side of a stringer. I still can't believe I did that. Cars fit back in the garage. The outside of the house and the yard are slowly having less of a depressing effect upon local real-estate values. Our twenty-four year-old beater of a Suburban labours out to the old, WWII hangar at Boundary Bay laden with flying kit, tools, parts, plans and an air compressor. And everytime I walk into that hangar with a list of adjustments to make and a couple pf minor snags to tend to, I see this creation poised there on its swept-back gear, looking like it's going transonic just at rest, resplendent-no, glowing- in white-and-red Imron paint with sixtie's-era, RCAF Tutor markings. The big, red spinner points up with attitude as if sniffing the air before leaping into it. And I invariably think-Hell, I'll work on it later. Let's throw the 'chute and helmet into it, push it out and call for the fuel bowser. It's easier than I thought to overlook all the paint runs, smiles and dings, chewed up screw heads and waves in the skin panels. Oh yeah-you're probably wondering why I'm disappointed. Well, I didn't get "The Grin." When the prop stopped and I rolled the canopy back and raised my visor, my expression could best be described as stunned. I was astonished that it actually worked, Everything worked, from the homemade annunciator panel, the WAG of offset for the vertical stab to the dual-throttle system I dreamed up. The full-size B8 stick grips from Wicks and the mil-surplus F-86 throttle grip feel so good I'm reluctant to let go to adjust the DG, altimeter or comm. So, it's been said before-and I've looked forward to saying this-but, keep pounding those rivets! I know at times it seems like it will never be finished, especially towards the end; and air tools seems to be lubricated with blood, sweat and tears. I know it seems to gobble money as fast as Froot Loops disappear into a teenager's mouth. Trust me, you will not be disappointed. It will be worth it. Oh, man, is it worth it! Say, I think I feel a grin comin' on...... Scott in Vancouver pictures just uploaded to matronics. com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020917/67e92ef0/attachment.htm From BBaines at led.bc.ca Tue Sep 17 20:48:34 2002 From: BBaines at led.bc.ca (Bill Baines) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV4 Wings and Partial Empenage for Sale (Vancouver BC) Message-ID: <000101c25ec6$43bc3aa0$670c010a@WORKSHOP> This is not an easy message to post... Change in situation has forced me to think about selling my RV-4 project. Everything has been in storage in a hanger in Langley, BC. The wings and most of the empenage are available (The HS was damaged during a move, and must be rebuilt). As for the wings, Both wings were in the jig, all ribs attached to spars (not riveted yet) and many if the skins have been drilled. Basically the wings are in a state where someone could take over, knowing what they have to work with, and could move forward with the project. Jig parts are included, and a landing light kit is included. All supplied parts, fasteners, drawings, and my builder's log will go with the package. I am an AME (not a structures AME) but I have sheet metal training. Have had some complements on the workmanship -- but you be the judge. Asking $2200.00 Cdn. Motivated to sell before end of September. Have to move out of the hanger. Thanks Bill Baines Bill Baines Phone 604 602 0281 Transport Canada Delegate DAR 312 Cell 604 220 1128 Newbrighton Avionics Design Services Fax 604 602 9239 Box27 Newbrighton BBaines@led.bc.ca RR3 Gibsons, VE7FML BC, Canada, V0N 1V0 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020917/ee27b82c/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Sep 25 19:51:01 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:19 2005 Subject: [Wing] Partial RV-4 Kit For Sale Message-ID: <20020925192518.C94677-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> Wing Members: I've had a look at the partial RV-4 kit that Bill Baines advertised here a week or two ago. (It's also on the Wing web page classifieds, www.vansairforce.org/classifieds/.) At $2,200, I thought it was worth looking into, even though I have enough on my plate already with my RV-6 kit. Here's what I saw. My overall assessment is that if you want to build an RV-4 you should definitely consider this deal. What you've essentially got is an RV-4 quick-build wing, and a mostly-complete tail, for not much more than the price of an unassembled tail kit (once exchange rate and taxes are figured in). This will save you about CDN$7,000 (plus PST, if you live in BC), and probably over five hundred hours of work. The kit is exactly as Bill described it. The workmanship appears to be very good, to my untrained but getting-more-experienced-every-day eye. The tail--less horizontal stab--is essentially finished (though not inspected), and the wings are assembled, drilled, and ready to skin, with one caveat. Because the ribs aren't primed, there is some superficial corrosion from being in storage, and you'd probably want to clean that up with Scotchbrite pads and prime them. Not a big deal, only a couple of day's work, even for a beginning builder. There is no horizontal stab. There was one, but it was lost in an accident which, if it's not your kit, is pretty funny. I'll let Bill tell you about it. I guess you'd have to buy all the parts for an HS from Van's, but that shouldn't be any problem. Since you normally start with the HS anyway, that will be a good introduction for a new builder. Once you're done that, you'll feel confident enough to move on and finish the nearly-finished wings. There's also a free-standing wing jig, which will save you some time, too. If you're interested, you can contact Bill at 604-220-1128. Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tlaw at klondiker.com Thu Sep 26 16:58:50 2002 From: tlaw at klondiker.com (Tom and Marilyn Law) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Bracket on F-649 Message-ID: <004f01c265b8$a93c89e0$3feff7c7@whtvcable.com> Hi, I may be having a case of "Blueprint Vision Overload" (it would not be the first time..... nor the second ...) but print page #37 in the upper right corner shows a end view of the F-649 removable flap mechanism cover with some type of bracket or support attached to the inside of it about 1/2 way up. Possibly it is something to separate the rudder cable from the flap mechanism should the cable sag down?? Where in the prints does it show what it is and how it is attached? Tom Law RV6A in Whitehorse, Yukon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020926/a0a2074a/attachment.htm From gmcnutt at intergate.ca Thu Sep 26 18:49:33 2002 From: gmcnutt at intergate.ca (George McNutt) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Bracket on F-649 In-Reply-To: <004f01c265b8$a93c89e0$3feff7c7@whtvcable.com> Message-ID: -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On Behalf Of Tom and Marilyn Law Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 4:59 PM To: wing@vansairforce.org Subject: [Wing] Bracket on F-649 Hi, I may be having a case of "Blueprint Vision Overload" (it would not be the first time..... nor the second ...) but print page #37 in the upper right corner shows a end view of the F-649 removable flap mechanism cover with some type of bracket or support attached to the inside of it about 1/2 way up. Possibly it is something to separate the rudder cable from the flap mechanism should the cable sag down?? Where in the prints does it show what it is and how it is attached? Tom Law RV6A in Whitehorse, Yukon [George McNutt] Sharp eyes Tom, I missed that when building mine and did not install anything where the bracket is shown. No problems with rudder cable. You could always install a bracket later during final assembly when you see the relationship between the flap assembly and rudder cable, put it on your "to do" list. Those removable panels are a trickey fit. Make sure they are easy to remove/install for servicing, flap adjustment etc. and to avoid future frustration put the instructions (this corner first etc) on the back side of the panel. George McNutt 6A - flying. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020926/c917f504/attachment.htm From mdeg at shaw.ca Thu Sep 26 19:16:11 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Message-ID: <002201c265cb$d939b740$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Has anyone had any problems with the chain clips on the tailwheel spreading out ..? I've had to replace a couple already......one I know I turned too sharp and the tailwheel went over center and spread it out but the others I'm not sure what is happening...... In the meantime I've put some lock wire on the clip so it can't open up..... Marc DeG......... 75 hours and still grinning..... mdeg@shaw.ca Ph: (306)934-4434 Fax(306) 934-4551 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020926/ee11471a/attachment.htm From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Fri Sep 27 11:39:52 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Bracket on F-649 References: <004f01c265b8$a93c89e0$3feff7c7@whtvcable.com> Message-ID: <001501c26655$c2243000$e41ab8a1@dgmurray> Tom- The bracket you are refering to was designed years ago by Art Chard as a possible saftey item. The idea of the bracket was that IF the rudder cables were loosened while ground handling the aircraft, the bracket would support the loose rudder cable so that it could not loop down and get tangled in the flap mechanism. The bracket is attached by a couple AN3-3.5 rivets. Hope this helps, Doug Murray Mountain View , AB RV-6 C-GRPA flying ----- Original Message ----- From: Tom and Marilyn Law To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 5:58 PM Subject: [Wing] Bracket on F-649 Hi, I may be having a case of "Blueprint Vision Overload" (it would not be the first time..... nor the second ...) but print page #37 in the upper right corner shows a end view of the F-649 removable flap mechanism cover with some type of bracket or support attached to the inside of it about 1/2 way up. Possibly it is something to separate the rudder cable from the flap mechanism should the cable sag down?? Where in the prints does it show what it is and how it is attached? Tom Law RV6A in Whitehorse, Yukon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020927/afd76181/attachment.htm From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Fri Sep 27 11:49:06 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips References: <002201c265cb$d939b740$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <002301c26656$8f254440$e41ab8a1@dgmurray> Marc - do you have the clip in correctly - You do - but I just had to ask! I found that although I have the double pointed ends of the clip both through the chain and the round end through the wheel horn, the clip will occasionally flip itself around the other way so the double poInted end of the clip is facing aft. I have a full swivel tailwheel too, so I am wondering if you have a non swivel wheel and are trying to turn too sharp. Happy flying Doug Murray Mountain view, AB RV-6 C-GRPA almost 60 hours BIG GRIN:-)) ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: wing@vansairforce.org Cc: RV-4 group Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 8:16 PM Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Has anyone had any problems with the chain clips on the tailwheel spreading out ..? I've had to replace a couple already......one I know I turned too sharp and the tailwheel went over center and spread it out but the others I'm not sure what is happening...... In the meantime I've put some lock wire on the clip so it can't open up..... Marc DeG......... 75 hours and still grinning..... mdeg@shaw.ca Ph: (306)934-4434 Fax(306) 934-4551 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020927/26a1ee2b/attachment.htm From mdeg at shaw.ca Fri Sep 27 13:14:05 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips References: <002201c265cb$d939b740$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> <002301c26656$8f254440$e41ab8a1@dgmurray> Message-ID: <006801c26662$6e53a980$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Hi Doug, Thanks for the reply........Well I never thought that they could be in the wrong way round.............I do not have the full swivelling tailwheel. It happened once that I did turn too sharp but the other times it was after landing and shutting down that I noticed it.........The open ( double pointed end) are both facing aft now.......am I hearing you correctly that they are the wrong way ? Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: Douglas G. Murray To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 12:49 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Marc - do you have the clip in correctly - You do - but I just had to ask! I found that although I have the double pointed ends of the clip both through the chain and the round end through the wheel horn, the clip will occasionally flip itself around the other way so the double poInted end of the clip is facing aft. I have a full swivel tailwheel too, so I am wondering if you have a non swivel wheel and are trying to turn too sharp. Happy flying Doug Murray Mountain view, AB RV-6 C-GRPA almost 60 hours BIG GRIN:-)) ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: wing@vansairforce.org Cc: RV-4 group Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 8:16 PM Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Has anyone had any problems with the chain clips on the tailwheel spreading out ..? I've had to replace a couple already......one I know I turned too sharp and the tailwheel went over center and spread it out but the others I'm not sure what is happening...... In the meantime I've put some lock wire on the clip so it can't open up..... Marc DeG......... 75 hours and still grinning..... mdeg@shaw.ca Ph: (306)934-4434 Fax(306) 934-4551 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020927/32cdfe02/attachment.htm From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Sat Sep 28 20:17:51 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips References: <002201c265cb$d939b740$db874718@ss.shawcable.net><002301c26656$8f254440$e41ab8a1@dgmurray> <006801c26662$6e53a980$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <002101c26766$eac99600$f61cb8a1@dgmurray> Marc - The pointed ends - both of them - should be hooked through the chain and the rounded end should be through the steering horn at the wheel. On the other end of the chain the two pointed ends of the clip should both be through the chain and the rounded end through the rudder horn. The fact that you have a non swivel type wheel COULD explain the stretching out of the clip IF you are turning too tight and forcing the turn radius with too much rudder pedal pressure. If BOTH pointed ends are hooked into the chain correctly I fail to see how the clip can separate as greater pressure will try to elongate the clip and the pointed end tails of the clip would attempt to straighten out. Since there is twice as much material at the pointed end of the clip compared to the rounded end , I would think that too great of pressure would manifest itself as a strectching out and lenghtening of the rounded end of the clip well before the pointed ends tried to straighten out. You might want to try out the full swivel wheel. The best $100.00 US you will ever spend as you can really turn the airplane around in a tight spot. Hope this helps. Doug Murray Mountain View, AB RV-6 C-GRPA ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 2:14 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Hi Doug, Thanks for the reply........Well I never thought that they could be in the wrong way round.............I do not have the full swivelling tailwheel. It happened once that I did turn too sharp but the other times it was after landing and shutting down that I noticed it.........The open ( double pointed end) are both facing aft now.......am I hearing you correctly that they are the wrong way ? Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: Douglas G. Murray To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 12:49 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Marc - do you have the clip in correctly - You do - but I just had to ask! I found that although I have the double pointed ends of the clip both through the chain and the round end through the wheel horn, the clip will occasionally flip itself around the other way so the double poInted end of the clip is facing aft. I have a full swivel tailwheel too, so I am wondering if you have a non swivel wheel and are trying to turn too sharp. Happy flying Doug Murray Mountain view, AB RV-6 C-GRPA almost 60 hours BIG GRIN:-)) ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: wing@vansairforce.org Cc: RV-4 group Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 8:16 PM Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Has anyone had any problems with the chain clips on the tailwheel spreading out ..? I've had to replace a couple already......one I know I turned too sharp and the tailwheel went over center and spread it out but the others I'm not sure what is happening...... In the meantime I've put some lock wire on the clip so it can't open up..... Marc DeG......... 75 hours and still grinning..... mdeg@shaw.ca Ph: (306)934-4434 Fax(306) 934-4551 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020928/27930269/attachment.htm From kiwi at sunwave.net Mon Sep 30 08:58:43 2002 From: kiwi at sunwave.net (Barry Tunzelmann) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Kit Lycoming Message-ID: <01C2685F.94DEB3C0.kiwi@sunwave.net> I thought this subject would have raised a lot of messages in the wing but in the October Kitplane there is an article about the new kit engine O-360 that they will sell to Joe Public - no experience necessary. The company is ECI and according to the article the complete Lycoming kit will sell for $14,700US minus carb and mags. That takes away the stranglehold that Superior/Mattituck had for the kit XP360 which was only a slightly better price than a new Lycoming through Vans. ECI website is www.ecitofly.com The engine has to be assembled and it cannot be installed in a certified plane - ok. From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon Sep 30 09:34:43 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Kit Lycoming In-Reply-To: <01C2685F.94DEB3C0.kiwi@sunwave.net> Message-ID: <20020930092156.U80883-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> Sounds interesting. Looks like the URL is www.eci2fly.com, but I couldn't find anything about the experimental engine there. If anyone finds information on the web aobut ECI's experimental engine, perhaps you can post the link here. Tedd McHenry From cliffada at telusplanet.net Mon Sep 30 18:30:18 2002 From: cliffada at telusplanet.net (Cliff E Adams) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #127 - 2 msgs References: <20020930190000.9028.81056.Mailman@strongbad.retrix.com> Message-ID: <002e01c268ea$1a3c7180$c08cb8a1@telusplanet.net> I had a look at the site as well and then wrote the folks at eci. I'll include what they sent to me as well as my original email to eci. Barry and I had a quick chat about the ECI thing while we were putting the wings on his bird. For what it's worth heres the communications I sent and their reply. My take is that ECI is not quite ready to do the entire engine kit yet. Perhaps in 6 months or so... we'll see ... I hope this helps some Cliff Adams The ECI Folks wrote: Thank you for your interest in our engine kit. We have not yet posted info on our web site because the kit as it is now is not complete. We have most of the parts and they do come boxed individually. Aero Sport Power (Progressive) in Kamloops BC supports this engine and can fill in the parts that are not included with their stock. The current kit does not come with an accessory housing (rear of case), push rods, major overhaul gasket kit, or the AN hardware. It comes with a center mounted carburetor mount oil sump, if you are going injected, you would need to get a different sump. We are working on making the accessory housing and other parts to complete the kit. We are also working on the accessories themselves to be included in the future. As it is now, the kit cost is $14,700. I can send you a list of what is included if you give me your address. The only volume discounts that we extend are to engine shops that do a lot of business with us (such as Progressive). Kind regards, Jim Ball -----Original Message----- From: Joe Trampota Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 7:41 AM To: James Ball Subject: FW: O 360 Kit Engines Joe Trampota jtrampota@eci2fly.com -----Original Message----- From: Cliff Adams [mailto:cliffada@telusplanet.net] Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2002 6:26 PM To: sales-service@eci2fly.com Subject: O 360 Kit Engines Sirs I just read the article in October Kitplanes and would like more information about the O360 kit engine. I'm presently halfway through an RV7A and will be looking for an engine soon. Vans offers the O360 for a reasonable discount but with the Canadian dollar in the tank it is still a large chunk of change. Specifically: 1. Please provide me with a cost esitmate for a complete O 360 engine (Dynafocal 1 Mount) handling a constant speed prop (Hartzel C2YK-1BF/F7666A4) 2. Can I obtain a governor (compatible with the prop above) to go with the engine? 3. Can I build a fuel-injected version of the O-360 kit? If not, what accessories come with the kit? 4. How is the engine kit shipped, (large crate of parts or individual boxes?) and the weight of the complete kit. 5. Lead times for orders 6. There are at least 4 other RV7 builders in the beginning stages of their projects in my immediate geographic area. Is there any opportunity for volume discounts? Note: KitPlanes has your website as ecitofly.com rather than eci2fly.com I've got lots more questions but they'll have to come when I've learned more about kit build engines. I couldn't find much on your website about the kit engines you are planning so I'll have to call in a few days. Thanks so much Cliff Adams Edmonton, Canada ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, September 30, 2002 1:00 PM Subject: Wing digest, Vol 1 #127 - 2 msgs : Send Wing mailing list submissions to : wing@vansairforce.org : : To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit : http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing : or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to : wing-request@vansairforce.org : : You can reach the person managing the list at : wing-admin@vansairforce.org : : When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific : than "Re: Contents of Wing digest..." : : : Today's Topics: : : 1. Kit Lycoming (Barry Tunzelmann) : 2. Re: Kit Lycoming (Tedd McHenry) : : --__--__-- : : Message: 1 : From: Barry Tunzelmann : To: "'wing@vansairforce.org'" : Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 08:58:43 -0700 : Organization: K-1 Design Services Ltd : Subject: [Wing] Kit Lycoming : Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org : : I thought this subject would have raised a lot of messages in the wing but : in the October Kitplane there is an article about the new kit engine O-360 : that they will sell to Joe Public - no experience necessary. The company is : ECI and according to the article the complete Lycoming kit will sell for : $14,700US minus carb and mags. That takes away the stranglehold that : Superior/Mattituck had for the kit XP360 which was only a slightly better : price than a new Lycoming through Vans. ECI website is www.ecitofly.com The : engine has to be assembled and it cannot be installed in a certified plane : - ok. : : --__--__-- : : Message: 2 : Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2002 09:34:43 -0700 (PDT) : From: Tedd McHenry : To: "'wing@vansairforce.org'" : Subject: Re: [Wing] Kit Lycoming : Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org : : Sounds interesting. : : Looks like the URL is www.eci2fly.com, but I couldn't find anything about the : experimental engine there. If anyone finds information on the web aobut ECI's : experimental engine, perhaps you can post the link here. : : Tedd McHenry : : : : --__--__-- : : _______________________________________________ : Wing mailing list : Wing@vansairforce.org : http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing : : : End of Wing Digest From mdeg at shaw.ca Tue Oct 1 17:58:00 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips References: <002201c265cb$d939b740$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> <002301c26656$8f254440$e41ab8a1@dgmurray> <006801c26662$6e53a980$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> <002101c26766$eac99600$f61cb8a1@dgmurray> Message-ID: <004601c269ae$c1739a40$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Hi Doug......just got back from Kindersley flyin. Four RV's in attendance .......:-) I think what is happening is that: as you increase the rudder pressure to decrease turning radius the tailwheel goes over center and the clips sometimes rotate themselves off of the tailwheel bracket, so that only one leg is still attached and then it can spread out........This probably also happens although more quickly when in the landing roll if a hole or rut is hit and the wheel moves back and forth quickly. The wrap of lockwire seemed to have helped with that problem as the clip can't rotate and open up...........at least for now. Another RV-4 here has installed the Jantzie tail spring with a full castering wheel......I will wait to see how it works and perhaps install it with a full swivel tailwheel also. thanks for the info.......ttyl Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: Douglas G. Murray To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Saturday, September 28, 2002 9:17 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Marc - The pointed ends - both of them - should be hooked through the chain and the rounded end should be through the steering horn at the wheel. On the other end of the chain the two pointed ends of the clip should both be through the chain and the rounded end through the rudder horn. The fact that you have a non swivel type wheel COULD explain the stretching out of the clip IF you are turning too tight and forcing the turn radius with too much rudder pedal pressure. If BOTH pointed ends are hooked into the chain correctly I fail to see how the clip can separate as greater pressure will try to elongate the clip and the pointed end tails of the clip would attempt to straighten out. Since there is twice as much material at the pointed end of the clip compared to the rounded end , I would think that too great of pressure would manifest itself as a strectching out and lenghtening of the rounded end of the clip well before the pointed ends tried to straighten out. You might want to try out the full swivel wheel. The best $100.00 US you will ever spend as you can really turn the airplane around in a tight spot. Hope this helps. Doug Murray Mountain View, AB RV-6 C-GRPA ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 2:14 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Hi Doug, Thanks for the reply........Well I never thought that they could be in the wrong way round.............I do not have the full swivelling tailwheel. It happened once that I did turn too sharp but the other times it was after landing and shutting down that I noticed it.........The open ( double pointed end) are both facing aft now.......am I hearing you correctly that they are the wrong way ? Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: Douglas G. Murray To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 12:49 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Marc - do you have the clip in correctly - You do - but I just had to ask! I found that although I have the double pointed ends of the clip both through the chain and the round end through the wheel horn, the clip will occasionally flip itself around the other way so the double poInted end of the clip is facing aft. I have a full swivel tailwheel too, so I am wondering if you have a non swivel wheel and are trying to turn too sharp. Happy flying Doug Murray Mountain view, AB RV-6 C-GRPA almost 60 hours BIG GRIN:-)) ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: wing@vansairforce.org Cc: RV-4 group Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 8:16 PM Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Has anyone had any problems with the chain clips on the tailwheel spreading out ..? I've had to replace a couple already......one I know I turned too sharp and the tailwheel went over center and spread it out but the others I'm not sure what is happening...... In the meantime I've put some lock wire on the clip so it can't open up..... Marc DeG......... 75 hours and still grinning..... mdeg@shaw.ca Ph: (306)934-4434 Fax(306) 934-4551 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021001/f352ec6b/attachment.htm From ve7fp at jetstream.net Tue Oct 1 19:05:06 2002 From: ve7fp at jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Kit Lycoming In-Reply-To: <01C2685F.94DEB3C0.kiwi@sunwave.net> Message-ID: <001c01c269b8$21d34cb0$15897240@cs> Hi Barry, No thanks. For not too much more you can get an engine from Bart at Aerosport that is ready to install, comes complete with Mags, Carb, and I believe a lightweight starter and has been test run, it also has a 3 year warranty. Every time I am flying and hear a hic up my ears go into sensitive mode something like automatic rough every time I fly over water!! If I built up a kit engine I would have to say Five Our Fathers and Ten Hail Mary's before every flight. The engine is the vital part of your airplane, for a couple of grand I want to enjoy piece of mind and not worry if I installed every part correctly, torqued every bolt to the right value, and know I have a good warranty program. When you want your appendix out you go to a doctor, when you want a loan you go to your banker, when you need a reliable aircraft engine you go to Bart! Ken RV6 C-FKEH First Flight Sept. 9, 1993 -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org] On Behalf Of Barry Tunzelmann Sent: Monday, September 30, 2002 8:59 AM To: 'wing@vansairforce.org' Subject: [Wing] Kit Lycoming I thought this subject would have raised a lot of messages in the wing but in the October Kitplane there is an article about the new kit engine O-360 that they will sell to Joe Public - no experience necessary. The company is ECI and according to the article the complete Lycoming kit will sell for $14,700US minus carb and mags. That takes away the stranglehold that Superior/Mattituck had for the kit XP360 which was only a slightly better price than a new Lycoming through Vans. ECI website is www.ecitofly.com The engine has to be assembled and it cannot be installed in a certified plane - ok. _______________________________________________ Wing mailing list Wing@vansairforce.org http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From rv7 at b4.ca Wed Oct 2 08:01:19 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Kit Lycoming References: <001c01c269b8$21d34cb0$15897240@cs> Message-ID: <3D9B0A3F.3060102@b4.ca> I think that might be a bit extreme, Ken. I agree that the economics of a kit engine don't really work out right now, the Superior engine seems to cost the same as a new engine from Bart or Vans, and this ECI one doesn't seem to be a "complete" kit, so it might get up there too by the time it's in there. But to say that the engine is the critical part of your airplane is kind of silly. The wings are critical too, and you are building them. Heck, in terms of airframe, the horizontal stab is pretty critical too, yet it's the first part you build when your skills are at their weakest. By your logic (when you need a reliable aircraft engine you go to bart), maybe you should continue to say that when you need a reliable aircraft, you should go to a factory built one. Or when you need reliable ground handling, you should go to a nosewheel. Building an engine isn't rocket science, any more than building an airplane is. You learned to build an airplane, you could easily learn to build an engine too. But to make it worth-while, you really need to get a kit that doesn't cost the same as a complete engine. Half to 2/3 of the cost of an equivalent engine is what it would take for me to buy one. -Rob Prior rv7 "at" b4.ca RV-7 Empennage (and still debating between Bart, Van's, and Jabiru for engines) Ken Hoshowski wrote: > Hi Barry, > > No thanks. For not too much more you can get an engine from Bart at > Aerosport that is ready to install, comes complete with Mags, Carb, and > I believe a lightweight starter and has been test run, it also has a 3 > year warranty. Every time I am flying and hear a hic up my ears go into > sensitive mode something like automatic rough every time I fly over > water!! If I built up a kit engine I would have to say Five Our Fathers > and Ten Hail Mary's before every flight. The engine is the vital part > of your airplane, for a couple of grand I want to enjoy piece of mind > and not worry if I installed every part correctly, torqued every bolt to > the right value, and know I have a good warranty program. > When you want your appendix out you go to a doctor, when you want a loan > you go to your banker, when you need a reliable aircraft engine you go > to Bart! > > Ken > > RV6 C-FKEH > First Flight Sept. 9, 1993 From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Wed Oct 2 10:16:24 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips References: <002201c265cb$d939b740$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> <002301c26656$8f254440$e41ab8a1@dgmurray> <006801c26662$6e53a980$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> <002101c26766$eac99600$f61cb8a1@dgmurray> <004601c269ae$c1739a40$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <008e01c26a37$6f99ef60$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> I was advised by the local RV folks up here in the Western Canada Wing to use eyebolts in the Rudder horn and the tailwheel steering arm and fit the chain clips thru them. Absolutely zero wear and no hang ups. Scott in Vancouver -6, 30hrs ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: dgmurray@telusplanet.net Cc: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 5:58 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Hi Doug......just got back from Kindersley flyin. Four RV's in attendance .......:-) I think what is happening is that: as you increase the rudder pressure to decrease turning radius the tailwheel goes over center and the clips sometimes rotate themselves off of the tailwheel bracket, so that only one leg is still attached and then it can spread out........This probably also happens although more quickly when in the landing roll if a hole or rut is hit and the wheel moves back and forth quickly. The wrap of lockwire seemed to have helped with that problem as the clip can't rotate and open up...........at least for now. Another RV-4 here has installed the Jantzie tail spring with a full castering wheel......I will wait to see how it works and perhaps install it with a full swivel tailwheel also. thanks for the info.......ttyl Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: Douglas G. Murray To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Saturday, September 28, 2002 9:17 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Marc - The pointed ends - both of them - should be hooked through the chain and the rounded end should be through the steering horn at the wheel. On the other end of the chain the two pointed ends of the clip should both be through the chain and the rounded end through the rudder horn. The fact that you have a non swivel type wheel COULD explain the stretching out of the clip IF you are turning too tight and forcing the turn radius with too much rudder pedal pressure. If BOTH pointed ends are hooked into the chain correctly I fail to see how the clip can separate as greater pressure will try to elongate the clip and the pointed end tails of the clip would attempt to straighten out. Since there is twice as much material at the pointed end of the clip compared to the rounded end , I would think that too great of pressure would manifest itself as a strectching out and lenghtening of the rounded end of the clip well before the pointed ends tried to straighten out. You might want to try out the full swivel wheel. The best $100.00 US you will ever spend as you can really turn the airplane around in a tight spot. Hope this helps. Doug Murray Mountain View, AB RV-6 C-GRPA ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 2:14 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Hi Doug, Thanks for the reply........Well I never thought that they could be in the wrong way round.............I do not have the full swivelling tailwheel. It happened once that I did turn too sharp but the other times it was after landing and shutting down that I noticed it.........The open ( double pointed end) are both facing aft now.......am I hearing you correctly that they are the wrong way ? Marc ----- Original Message ----- From: Douglas G. Murray To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 12:49 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Marc - do you have the clip in correctly - You do - but I just had to ask! I found that although I have the double pointed ends of the clip both through the chain and the round end through the wheel horn, the clip will occasionally flip itself around the other way so the double poInted end of the clip is facing aft. I have a full swivel tailwheel too, so I am wondering if you have a non swivel wheel and are trying to turn too sharp. Happy flying Doug Murray Mountain view, AB RV-6 C-GRPA almost 60 hours BIG GRIN:-)) ----- Original Message ----- From: Marc Degirolamo To: wing@vansairforce.org Cc: RV-4 group Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 8:16 PM Subject: [Wing] tailwheel chain clips Has anyone had any problems with the chain clips on the tailwheel spreading out ..? I've had to replace a couple already......one I know I turned too sharp and the tailwheel went over center and spread it out but the others I'm not sure what is happening...... In the meantime I've put some lock wire on the clip so it can't open up..... Marc DeG......... 75 hours and still grinning..... mdeg@shaw.ca Ph: (306)934-4434 Fax(306) 934-4551 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021002/e805e3f7/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Mon Oct 14 11:09:54 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV-6 Aero Certification in the UK Message-ID: <20021014110759.I33180-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> I heard recently that although the RV-4 is approved for aeros in the UK, the RV-6 is not. Does anyone know why they're making this distinction between the two airplanes over there? Apparently, it has something to do with the horizontal stab. Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Oct 15 07:15:44 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] UK Aerobatic CLX for RVs Message-ID: <20021015071244.J94763-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> A couple of days ago I brought up the issue of the PFA in the UK not approving the RV-6 for aeros. Today I received the email below on the subject from Piers Herbert. Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 13:06:56 +0100 From: Piers Herbert To: tedd@vansairforce.org Subject: Aeros clearance in the UK Hello Tedd This is in response to a query which was foreworded to the UK RV squadron list. As you say the RV-4 is cleared for aeros in the UK. The 6, 7 and 8 are not. This is mainly due to the fact that the PFA acceptance engineer (John Tempest) has yet to be convinced that the HS meets the strength requirements (presumably based on FAR/JAR 23 aerobatic category). He is insisting on a static load test of a specimen HS before he will be convinced. (I believe that John Tempest and Ken Krueuger disagree on this issue). As I understand it, arrangements are being made to do the required test in the UK, and Vans have kindly offered to donate a HS for this purpose. I believe that the HS structure is the same for the 6, 7 and 8. Presently I am holding off completing my HS in the (hpoefully unlikely) event that the PFA should insinst on a strengthening mod.) The one other thing that will have to be done before aeros clearance can be given for the RV-6 (and 7 when one is completed in the UK), is that the type will have to be test flown in aeros and spinning by the PFA acceptance test pilot. In the case of the 8, this has already been done (the PFA gave a one off aeros authorisation for acceptance test flying only). Regards, Piers Herbert RV-8, wings From tedd at vansairforce.org Sun Oct 20 11:39:13 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] C-GSEV: The Immitutor Message-ID: <20021020113722.K924-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> C-GSEV, the Immitutor, is an RV-6 built by Scott Jackson, of White Rock, BC. The Immitutor's first flight was last summer, and we now have some pictures of it on the Wing web site. http://www.vansairforce.org/airplanes/C-GSEV/ Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From rv7 at b4.ca Mon Oct 21 14:37:22 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] [Fwd: RV-List: Another good engine scorce] Message-ID: <3DB47392.9090803@b4.ca> From the RV-List. Might be a good place to get a quote from, if anyone is comparing prices. -RB4 -------- Original Message -------- Subject: RV-List: Another good engine scorce Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2002 17:50:44 -0300 From: "Joe Hine" Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com To: "Rv-List@Matronics.Com" --> RV-List message posted by: "Joe Hine" Listers I just thought I would pass along another good engine shop that would be worth getting a quote from if you are looking for an engine. This is a canadian shop in Halifax Nova Scotia and he has a number of engines in stock that he would build up for homebuilts. He is calling them homebuilt engines because he has a stock of engine parts he has bought at auctions and cannot legally put them in certified engines. This is a shop that also builds certified engines and all his engines come with a warrenty. I have delt with the owner myself and have no reservations in directing you to him. If I was looking for an engine this is where I would be going. I have no connection with this business other than customer. The shop is Aerotec Engines, the owner is Jason Crowell. Their numbers are 902-873-3100,phone 902-873-3101 fax and their email address is aerotec@dbis.ns.ca. Good Luck. Joe Hine RV4 C-FYTQ From Terence.Gannon at trican.ca Wed Oct 23 06:58:50 2002 From: Terence.Gannon at trican.ca (Gannon, Terence) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Calgary Hangar Opportunity Message-ID: A quick message to those building in and around the Calgary/Southern Alberta area that will eventually need hangar space for their finished aircraft, and/or workspace for their project, and would like to be located at Springbank (CYBW). Some new hangars are going up, and I'm investigating whether there is sufficient interest in some sort of arrangement to share space in one or two of the newly constructed bays. Please contact me directly, off list, to discuss further. Best regards... Terry in Calgary RV-6 S/N 24414 "Wings, Fuselage Arriving Today!" terence.gannon@trican.ca From dwvoth at hotmail.com Sun Oct 20 17:02:49 2002 From: dwvoth at hotmail.com (Dennis Voth) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] delete this email address References: <20021015190002.57204.81046.Mailman@strongbad.retrix.com> Message-ID: <000601c282f1$ee4feda0$ab709344@warsteiner> I am currently receiving vansairforce stuff on two email accounts. Please delete this one. Thanks. Dennis Voth ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 1:00 PM Subject: Wing digest, Vol 1 #131 - 1 msg > Send Wing mailing list submissions to > wing@vansairforce.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > wing-request@vansairforce.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > wing-admin@vansairforce.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Wing digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. UK Aerobatic CLX for RVs (Tedd McHenry) > > --__--__-- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 07:15:44 -0700 (PDT) > From: Tedd McHenry > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: [Wing] UK Aerobatic CLX for RVs > Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org > > A couple of days ago I brought up the issue of the PFA in the UK not approving > the RV-6 for aeros. Today I received the email below on the subject from Piers > Herbert. > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 13:06:56 +0100 > From: Piers Herbert > To: tedd@vansairforce.org > Subject: Aeros clearance in the UK > > Hello Tedd > > This is in response to a query which was foreworded to the UK RV squadron list. > > As you say the RV-4 is cleared for aeros in the UK. The 6, 7 and 8 are not. This is mainly due to the fact that the PFA acceptance engineer (John Tempest) has yet to be convinced that the HS meets the strength requirements (presumably based on FAR/JAR 23 aerobatic category). He is insisting on a static load test of a specimen HS before he will be convinced. (I believe that John Tempest and Ken Krueuger disagree on this issue). > > As I understand it, arrangements are being made to do the required test in the UK, and Vans have kindly offered to donate a HS for this purpose. I believe that the HS structure is the same for the 6, 7 and 8. Presently I am holding off completing my HS in the (hpoefully unlikely) event that the PFA should insinst on a strengthening mod.) > > The one other thing that will have to be done before aeros clearance can be given for the RV-6 (and 7 when one is completed in the UK), is that the type will have to be test flown in aeros and spinning by the PFA acceptance test pilot. In the case of the 8, this has already been done (the PFA gave a one off aeros authorisation for acceptance test flying only). > > Regards, > > Piers Herbert > RV-8, wings > > > > --__--__-- > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > End of Wing Digest > From acwrench at yahoo.ca Wed Nov 13 10:43:43 2002 From: acwrench at yahoo.ca (pat morency) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Calgary Hangar Opportunity In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20021113184343.7986.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Terry, How is it going? Been meaning to drop you a line and touch base with you. Can see the light at the end of the tunnel with the house reno's. Will probably have to move my wing jig as the winter gets here. Last year was hell trying to use only one bay of the garage, and not run into the prize possesion. Got your e mail about the need for hangar space at Springbank. I was out doing an annual inspection on a Cherokee 140 last weekend and noted the increase of hangar's put up in the last year. The cost is upward to 45k for a shared stall, and I understand the land cost are going up as well. Maybe Didsbury is the way to go. I heard you can get into a hangar for about 22k. Still a little way off! Busy until the mid DEC when I get back from California. Why don't we get together then for coffee and some plane chat. regards, Pat Morency --- "Gannon, Terence" wrote: > A quick message to those building in and around the > Calgary/Southern > Alberta area that will eventually need hangar space > for their finished > aircraft, and/or workspace for their project, and > would like to be > located at Springbank (CYBW). Some new hangars are > going up, and I'm > investigating whether there is sufficient interest > in some sort of > arrangement to share space in one or two of the > newly constructed bays. > Please contact me directly, off list, to discuss > further. Best > regards... > > Terry in Calgary > RV-6 S/N 24414 > "Wings, Fuselage Arriving Today!" > terence.gannon@trican.ca > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca From dvoth at shaw.ca Wed Nov 13 14:32:25 2002 From: dvoth at shaw.ca (Dennis Voth) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Calgary Hangar Opportunity References: <20021113184343.7986.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000f01c28b64$8a45b5d0$ab709344@warsteiner> How large is a "shared stall"? Is that for one aircraft max? Or is a "shared stall" something that would hold several small airplanes? What do you know about Airdrie airport? Dennis Voth (dvoth@shaw.ca) ----- Original Message ----- From: "pat morency" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 11:43 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] Calgary Hangar Opportunity > Terry, > How is it going? Been meaning to drop you a line and > touch base with you. Can see the light at the end of > the tunnel with the house reno's. Will probably have > to move my wing jig as the winter gets here. Last year > was hell trying to use only one bay of the garage, and > not run into the prize possesion. Got your e mail > about the need for hangar space at Springbank. I was > out doing an annual inspection on a Cherokee 140 last > weekend and noted the increase of hangar's put up in > the last year. The cost is upward to 45k for a shared > stall, and I understand the land cost are going up as > well. Maybe Didsbury is the way to go. I heard you can > get into a hangar for about 22k. > Still a little way off! Busy until the mid DEC when I > get back from California. Why don't we get together > then for coffee and some plane chat. > regards, > Pat Morency > --- "Gannon, Terence" > wrote: > A quick message to those building in and > around the > > Calgary/Southern > > Alberta area that will eventually need hangar space > > for their finished > > aircraft, and/or workspace for their project, and > > would like to be > > located at Springbank (CYBW). Some new hangars are > > going up, and I'm > > investigating whether there is sufficient interest > > in some sort of > > arrangement to share space in one or two of the > > newly constructed bays. > > Please contact me directly, off list, to discuss > > further. Best > > regards... > > > > Terry in Calgary > > RV-6 S/N 24414 > > "Wings, Fuselage Arriving Today!" > > terence.gannon@trican.ca > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From hwregget at shaw.ca Wed Nov 13 17:08:45 2002 From: hwregget at shaw.ca (Harv Wregget) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Calgary Hangar Opportunity References: <20021113184343.7986.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> <000f01c28b64$8a45b5d0$ab709344@warsteiner> Message-ID: <001501c28b7a$6313ace0$e9e24118@cg.shawcable.net> Dennis, Let me contribute a little to your questions below. I was involved initially with a group that were organizing to build a hangar for aircraft storage at Springbank. They ran into a few problems with settling the land lease details with the airport authority but last I heard it was going ahead. They were planning to use a new rotary aircraft storage system. The system operates like a 'lazy susan' with five aircraft stalls. It is housed in a building 76' x 76'. Looks like a very good idea and a good system to me. If you want more info on this, the contact is Alvin Hand, Innisfail, 403-227-1939. I backed out of the deal because I don't want to build in Springbank. I live in Airdrie and would like to put my airplane at the Airdrie Airport someday. However, things seem to be moving very slowly at Airdrie. I doubt that they will be ready for development next year. Airdrie is a little different in that it is not part of the Calgary Airport Authority like Springbank is. It is private and the lots are for sale, not for lease. That may mean higher prices for aircraft storage. I keep my plane at Olds-Didsbury. Although it is a little further out, Olds-Dids is a great little airport. Very little traffic and no ATC. Harv Wregget ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Voth" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 3:32 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Calgary Hangar Opportunity > How large is a "shared stall"? Is that for one aircraft max? Or is a > "shared stall" something that would hold several small airplanes? > > What do you know about Airdrie airport? > > Dennis Voth (dvoth@shaw.ca) From acwrench at yahoo.ca Thu Nov 14 19:57:24 2002 From: acwrench at yahoo.ca (pat morency) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Calgary Hangar Opportunity In-Reply-To: <001501c28b7a$6313ace0$e9e24118@cg.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <20021115035724.41079.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> Just a side bar to the Airdrie airport. I looked into the cost of one of those buiding lots and it came to 66k for the land with no services. The original site plan for the Springbank airport, while under Transport Canada rule, showed an area for private building lots, and that was at 0.05 cents a square foot. Since the airport authority has taken over the cost went immediately to 0.08 cents and now sits at 0.10 cents per. Latest rumours have it rising again. When the airport authority took on Springbank, I asked about the possibility of the private building lots coming available and was told it was a poor use of land to have a single hangar and it didn't fit with the plan for the airport. So, we now have several rows of beautiful hangars with all modern conveniences ranging from approx. 50k to 110k on lease land, which you have no control over improvements and pricing. pat --- Harv Wregget wrote: > Dennis, > > Let me contribute a little to your questions below. > I was involved > initially with a group that were organizing to build > a hangar for aircraft > storage at Springbank. They ran into a few problems > with settling the land > lease details with the airport authority but last I > heard it was going > ahead. They were planning to use a new rotary > aircraft storage system. The > system operates like a 'lazy susan' with five > aircraft stalls. It is housed > in a building 76' x 76'. Looks like a very good > idea and a good system to > me. If you want more info on this, the contact is > Alvin Hand, Innisfail, > 403-227-1939. > > I backed out of the deal because I don't want to > build in Springbank. I > live in Airdrie and would like to put my airplane at > the Airdrie Airport > someday. However, things seem to be moving very > slowly at Airdrie. I doubt > that they will be ready for development next year. > Airdrie is a little > different in that it is not part of the Calgary > Airport Authority like > Springbank is. It is private and the lots are for > sale, not for lease. > That may mean higher prices for aircraft storage. > > I keep my plane at Olds-Didsbury. Although it is a > little further out, > Olds-Dids is a great little airport. Very little > traffic and no ATC. > > Harv Wregget > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dennis Voth" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, November 13, 2002 3:32 PM > Subject: Re: [Wing] Calgary Hangar Opportunity > > > > How large is a "shared stall"? Is that for one > aircraft max? Or is a > > "shared stall" something that would hold several > small airplanes? > > > > What do you know about Airdrie airport? > > > > Dennis Voth (dvoth@shaw.ca) > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing ______________________________________________________________________ Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca From dvoth at shaw.ca Fri Nov 22 21:10:04 2002 From: dvoth at shaw.ca (Dennis Voth) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] 7A windshield Message-ID: <000801c292ae$95c20340$ab709344@warsteiner> Can anyone give us any hints as to how the sliding canopy windshield on the side-by-side RV's fits at the bottom sides? For instance, how high up do we trim the sides of the windshield? How does this fit with the forward-top skin where it curves back to the roll bar in a kind of tab? Do we trim the windshield even with the top of these skin tabs? How does all this "stuff" at the bottom-rear corners of the windshield cover with the fiberglass strip? I am having a difficult time visualizing how this all fits together. Also: the aluminum clips they show on the drawings - do you run these all down along the sides of the windshield as well as the front? How far apart? Puzzled in Calgary, Dennis -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021122/e2a214e0/attachment.htm From ernest.kells at sympatico.ca Sat Nov 23 22:51:13 2002 From: ernest.kells at sympatico.ca (Ernest Kells) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #139 - 1 msg References: <20021123200000.50075.82982.Mailman@strongbad.retrix.com> Message-ID: <008901c29385$f0cd1220$73bee2d1@hpcustomer> My experience is with the RV-9A but it should be the same as the RV-7 slider. >>> Can anyone give us any hints as to how the sliding canopy windshield on the side-by-side RV's fits at the bottom sides? For instance, how high up do we trim the sides of the windshield? How does this fit with the forward-top skin where it curves back to the roll bar in a kind of tab? Do we trim the windshield even with the top of these skin tabs? How does all this "stuff" at the bottom-rear corners of the windshield cover with the fiberglass strip? I am having a difficult time visualizing how this all fits together. <<< I don't know what you mean by "skin tabs". The windshield isn't cut as much as the canopy part. I think that it should go down an extra 1 1/2" or so. Look at the drawing side view very carefully. I cut mine too high, as well. After securing the windshield tightly with the side clip I put the 7 or 8 layers of cloth up. When it was all dried I put some epoxy resin - with micro-balloons on the inside between the epoxy layers and the roll bar weldment. It is all finished, looks really good, appears very strong. Slick!. >>> Also: the aluminum clips they show on the drawings - do you run these all down along the sides of the windshield as well as the front? How far apart? <<< I put five clips on the juncture of the windshield and the foredeck. I riveting the clips at the three ribs plus the sides. They were evenly spaced - reasonably so. I believe that they are primarily required to hold the two structures together until the epoxy sets up. Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop Finish Kit 85% Complete From dvoth at shaw.ca Sun Nov 24 18:29:50 2002 From: dvoth at shaw.ca (Dennis Voth) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #139 - 1 msg References: <20021123200000.50075.82982.Mailman@strongbad.retrix.com> <008901c29385$f0cd1220$73bee2d1@hpcustomer> Message-ID: <000b01c2942a$8832e7d0$ab709344@warsteiner> Ernest, when you say you cut yours too high, did you cut the windshield even with the skin-line? That is, the line of the skin as it goes back to the roll-bar. That is what the drawing looks like is called for. We think that is too high. We are thinking we should leave the windshield longer, to hang down below the level of the skin (and I am talking about the top forward fuselage skin). The only question we have is that if we do that, is there a problem with the bottom edge of that skin then wanting to stick out from the fuselage side when the windshield is attached to the roll bar (which would push the top of that piece of the skin into the roll bar, forcing the bottom out)? I appreciate you replying to our questions. Thanks, Dennis Voth, Calgary ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ernest Kells" To: Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 11:51 PM Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #139 - 1 msg > My experience is with the RV-9A but it should be the same as the RV-7 > slider. > > >>> Can anyone give us any hints as to how the sliding canopy windshield on > the side-by-side RV's fits at the bottom sides? For instance, how high up > do we trim the sides of the windshield? How does this fit with the > forward-top skin where it curves back to the roll bar in a kind of tab? Do > we trim the windshield even with the top of these skin tabs? How does all > this "stuff" at the bottom-rear corners of the windshield cover with the > fiberglass strip? I am having a difficult time visualizing how this all > fits together. <<< > > I don't know what you mean by "skin tabs". The windshield isn't cut as much > as the canopy part. I think that it should go down an extra 1 1/2" or so. > Look at the drawing side view very carefully. I cut mine too high, as well. > After securing the windshield tightly with the side clip I put the 7 or 8 > layers of cloth up. When it was all dried I put some epoxy resin - with > micro-balloons on the inside between the epoxy layers and the roll bar > weldment. It is all finished, looks really good, appears very strong. > Slick!. > > >>> Also: the aluminum clips they show on the drawings - do you run these > all down along the sides of the windshield as well as the front? How far > apart? <<< > > I put five clips on the juncture of the windshield and the foredeck. I > riveting the clips at the three ribs plus the sides. They were evenly > spaced - reasonably so. I believe that they are primarily required to hold > the two structures together until the epoxy sets up. > Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop > Finish Kit 85% Complete > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From wjoke at shaw.ca Sun Nov 24 19:42:05 2002 From: wjoke at shaw.ca (Jim Oke) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #139 - 1 msg References: <20021123200000.50075.82982.Mailman@strongbad.retrix.com> <008901c29385$f0cd1220$73bee2d1@hpcustomer> <000b01c2942a$8832e7d0$ab709344@warsteiner> Message-ID: <010801c29434$9fb5d7a0$6401a8c0@cd708596a> Hi Dennis; I think you are on the right track with your fuse skin "tabs" - which are formed be cutting a notch about 1/2" wide 2"-3" forward of the windshield bow. The bow should be set in from the outside of the longerons by 3/16" or so - the thickness of the canopy plastic. Thus the forward skin can lie flat against the fuselage side and extend upwards without bulging outwards. If necessary, some minor adjustment of the spanways dimension of the bow can be done to achieve this fit - it's a big strong piece of steel tubing so some muscle will be needed for this. When fitting the windscreen portion, the "tab" can be flexed out a bit, the plastic placed between the tab and the bow and then the tab allowed to spring back into place. Meanwhile forward of the notch, the fuse skin curves in and the plastic sits on top of the skin. The plastic is trimmed is to leave a smooth fit forward of the tab - it just continues that same curve aft of the tab. "Uncurling" the tab compared to the rest of the skin (where it forms a glareshield for the instrument panel) leaves enough of an overlap (1/2" - 3/4" ??) to seal against the plastic. There is a bit of a discontinuity and even a small hole to fill where the notch is cut. I added a good sized fillet of Cdn Tire body filler to smooth and fill this gap forward of the "tab". Careful trimming of the canopy to leave an angle or a chamfer at the bottom edge forward of the tab will reduce the size of this gap. The idea here is to end up with a smooth, even surface to layup the fibreglass windscreen fillet on. Cheers, Jim Oke CYWG RV-6A - wings went to the airport yesterday! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis Voth" To: Sent: Sunday, November 24, 2002 8:29 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #139 - 1 msg > Ernest, when you say you cut yours too high, did you cut the windshield even > with the skin-line? That is, the line of the skin as it goes back to the > roll-bar. That is what the drawing looks like is called for. We think that > is too high. We are thinking we should leave the windshield longer, to hang > down below the level of the skin (and I am talking about the top forward > fuselage skin). > > The only question we have is that if we do that, is there a problem with the > bottom edge of that skin then wanting to stick out from the fuselage side > when the windshield is attached to the roll bar (which would push the top of > that piece of the skin into the roll bar, forcing the bottom out)? > > I appreciate you replying to our questions. Thanks, Dennis Voth, Calgary > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ernest Kells" > To: > Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 11:51 PM > Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #139 - 1 msg > > > > My experience is with the RV-9A but it should be the same as the RV-7 > > slider. > > > > >>> Can anyone give us any hints as to how the sliding canopy windshield > on > > the side-by-side RV's fits at the bottom sides? For instance, how high up > > do we trim the sides of the windshield? How does this fit with the > > forward-top skin where it curves back to the roll bar in a kind of tab? > Do > > we trim the windshield even with the top of these skin tabs? How does all > > this "stuff" at the bottom-rear corners of the windshield cover with the > > fiberglass strip? I am having a difficult time visualizing how this all > > fits together. <<< > > > > I don't know what you mean by "skin tabs". The windshield isn't cut as > much > > as the canopy part. I think that it should go down an extra 1 1/2" or so. > > Look at the drawing side view very carefully. I cut mine too high, as > well. > > After securing the windshield tightly with the side clip I put the 7 or 8 > > layers of cloth up. When it was all dried I put some epoxy resin - with > > micro-balloons on the inside between the epoxy layers and the roll bar > > weldment. It is all finished, looks really good, appears very strong. > > Slick!. > > > > >>> Also: the aluminum clips they show on the drawings - do you run these > > all down along the sides of the windshield as well as the front? How far > > apart? <<< > > > > I put five clips on the juncture of the windshield and the foredeck. I > > riveting the clips at the three ribs plus the sides. They were evenly > > spaced - reasonably so. I believe that they are primarily required to > hold > > the two structures together until the epoxy sets up. > > Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop > > Finish Kit 85% Complete > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From ernest.kells at sympatico.ca Mon Nov 25 18:08:57 2002 From: ernest.kells at sympatico.ca (Ernest Kells) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #141 - 2 msgs References: <20021125200001.11625.12694.Mailman@strongbad.retrix.com> Message-ID: <003501c294f2$87415f00$9db3e2d1@hpcustomer> Dennis: I mean that I cut it too high. The gap was big enough to shove my thumb through. I realized that I made a mistake. I put the five clips through the foreward skin at the ribs - where possible. I put two of them on the sides. I made oversized clips of .063 so they would secure the windshield tightly, and overcoming the very slight "pouching out". I rounded the edges to minimize how much I would have to build up the windshield gap - so it wouldn't look knobby. It turned out quite well. After I had the gap covered by laying up several cloth and epoxy around the windshield intersection I let it harden, then I filled the inside (between the epoxy with micro-balloons and the rollbar weldment). I let it harden good then went back to the windshield intersection - perhaps eight thick layers in total including lots of sanding. My solution looks as good as any - but I did extra work to recover the situation. When everything hardened the whole assembly is very solid. After I separated the canopy from the windshield I was quite proud of how good it looks. People will look at and won't be able to figure what's different. The closed canopy will have a slight "pucker" at the base of the windshield. I could easily flare it out with micro-balloons - but I like the look (like an F-16 bubble look). Very slight, not noticeable. Vans wouldn't put it in the plans because of the extra work. P.S. Definitely leave the windshield longer - even with the side skin edge, but not much lower. It doesn't have to be "bonded for strength" at the overlap. Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop Finish Kit 85% Complete > Ernest, when you say you cut yours too high, did you cut the windshield even > with the skin-line? That is, the line of the skin as it goes back to the > roll-bar. That is what the drawing looks like is called for. We think that > is too high. We are thinking we should leave the windshield longer, to hang > down below the level of the skin (and I am talking about the top forward > fuselage skin). > > The only question we have is that if we do that, is there a problem with the > bottom edge of that skin then wanting to stick out from the fuselage side > when the windshield is attached to the roll bar (which would push the top of > that piece of the skin into the roll bar, forcing the bottom out)? From thomwhar at digitalweb.net Tue Nov 26 17:29:32 2002 From: thomwhar at digitalweb.net (Tom Wharton) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Firewall - RV6-A Message-ID: <000801c295b4$70c16690$ce2426d0@m0h8n5> A while back I saw information on a typical firewall penetration plan for the RV6-A but misplaced the reference. Does anyone know where I might download a copy? Tom Wharton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021126/a505ceba/attachment.htm From ham at hammcc.com Tue Nov 26 18:23:36 2002 From: ham at hammcc.com (Hamilton McClymont) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:20 2005 Subject: [Wing] Firewall - RV6-A In-Reply-To: <000801c295b4$70c16690$ce2426d0@m0h8n5> Message-ID: Tom: I saw this on the Yahoo Subaru site a couple of days ago and thought it might be useful. Cheers, Hammy 604-241-2480 www.hammcc.com From: "Charlie Walker" Date: Sat Nov 23, 2002 7:35 pm Subject: Re: [subaruaircraft] firewall hole locations Renner, The easy way to arrive at the exact location for all the holes and nut plates is to simply make a dummy firewall from .090 lexan. With the engine mounted, you can see all the underlying structure and drill all the holes where needed. If you make a mistake or change your mind, just put a piece of masking tape over the old hole and drill a new one. When satisfied with all the holes, use the final result for a drilling template on the stainless firewall. I've used this method for the last three aircraft and it works great. If you already have the stainless firewall riveted in place, disregard all the above. Charlie -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On Behalf Of Tom Wharton Sent: November 26, 2002 5:30 PM To: wing@vansairforce.org Subject: [Wing] Firewall - RV6-A A while back I saw information on a typical firewall penetration plan for the RV6-A but misplaced the reference. Does anyone know where I might download a copy? Tom Wharton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021126/b54fb97b/attachment.htm From rdkennett at shaw.ca Tue Nov 26 20:22:04 2002 From: rdkennett at shaw.ca (Della & Robert Kennett) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Firewall - RV6-A References: <000801c295b4$70c16690$ce2426d0@m0h8n5> Message-ID: <001901c295cc$8adb73a0$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Tom: There's a drawing for the RV 6, 7, and 9 in the First Issue 2001 RVator. I remember looking at after I had completed my firewall penetrations and thinking it would have worked for my RV-6A. If you don't have it, I could photocopy and mail it. How is Jelle Dykstra doing? I haven't talked to him since finishing my RV. Rob Kennett Westbank, BC ----- Original Message ----- From: Tom Wharton To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: November 26, 2002 5:29 PM Subject: [Wing] Firewall - RV6-A A while back I saw information on a typical firewall penetration plan for the RV6-A but misplaced the reference. Does anyone know where I might download a copy? Tom Wharton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021126/1b095628/attachment.htm From Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca Fri Nov 29 07:44:48 2002 From: Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca (Bob_Cutting@toyota.ca) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Wing digest, Vol 1 #141 - 2 msgs Message-ID: Hi Ernest, I see you are installing an 0-235 in your 9A, I have just completed my 9A (C-FRVC) and had the final inspection last week, its at Boundary Bay airport. I have the 0-290.D2 with high comp pistons and electronic ignition (Lightspeed Engineering). I have had to do quite a bit of re-enginnering of the carb heater box due to the fact that on the 0-290, the carb is placed quite a bit back on the sump, I think the 0-235 is the same, Vans have been no help at all in solving this dilemma, also the baffles do not fit and have to be re cut, Vans says that they only support the 0-320 even though the advertise the 9 as been suitable for the 0-235, 0-290,and 0-320.......... I hope to do my first flight in a week or so. I previously built a 6A with the 0-320, and only built the 9A so I could use a smaller engine and save 20% on fuel cost. It will be interesting to compare the two airplanes!! From ernest.kells at sympatico.ca Sat Nov 30 12:38:18 2002 From: ernest.kells at sympatico.ca (Ernest Kells) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Fw: Wing digest, Vol 1 #144 - 1 msg Message-ID: <009b01c298b1$68ca0aa0$3678d1d8@hpcustomer> Hello, Bob: Yes. I am building an RV-9A with the O-235. AND yes Vans gives great service - but only if you have an O-320 or O-360. >>I have completed my 9A (C-FRVC) and had the final inspection last week, its at Boundary Bay airport. << Congrats. Where are you? I am in Sault Ste. Marie, ON at the bottom of Lake Superior. If possible I would like to see your project - however this is a big country. >> I have the 0-290.D2 with high comp pistons and electronic ignition (Lightspeed Engineering). I have had to do quite a bit of re-enginnering of the carb heater box due to the fact that on the 0-290, the carb is placed quite a bit back on the sump, I think the 0-235> is the same, Vans have been no help at all in solving this dilemma, << I talked to Vans about this. They said that it was different but would be "easy" to fix. I ordered the Fab Air Box for the O-320. They said that all I had to do was order a piece of .063, use the flat plate from the kit as a template for the holes - and cut the carb hole differently when fitting, then return the O-320 part for refund. Everything else would be the same ? ? ? We'll See ! ! ! >> .... also the baffles do not fit and have to be re cut, Vans says that they only support the 0-320 even though the advertise the 9 as been suitable for the 0-235, 0-290,and 0-320.....<< Vans suggested that I buy a baffle set out of a Cessna C-150 (same engine), then use it directly or as a template. He said that it would fit around the cylinders (the hard part) then I would extend the baffles to fit the cowling (the easy part). I have called a few engine shops without luck - so far. A friend locally offerred to lend me his O-235 baffle to be used as a template. He doesn't fly it in winter. I'll probably have to take his wonderful offer. BTW: Vans said that the $7.00 Plans Only isn't viable - very old, not well written and pertains to the O-320 anyway. I decided to order it anyway, as a parts list, procedure, etc. If it is a piece of junk I'll return it. PERHAPS I could use the full size (???) drawings to trace the shapes onto a thin Formica sheet, then fit it on the engine for final adjustments pertaining to the O-235 and the RV-9A. Then transfer the dimensions to the aluminum for final cutting. Note: I have been known to be naive in other matters. One last area of difference. My engine flange is an SAE#1 - 6" flange with 3/8" holes. Vans could not supply the proper crush plate or the 2 1/4" prop extension. Although there are work-arounds that could work I ended up ordering a different solution from their supplier Saber. We are talking about that big thing on front spinning around at close to the speed of sound! ! ! It will be definitely be much superior - - but much more expensive. Such is life. I am unhappy about the cost - but I REALLY like the solution. Saber says that I should delete the harmonic dampener. I believe him as their solution will be much more stable. Happy flying. Ernest Kells - RV-9A O235-N2C, Wood Prop Finish Kit 85% Complete From Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca Mon Dec 2 15:48:05 2002 From: Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca (Bob_Cutting@toyota.ca) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Fw: Wing digest, Vol 1 #144 - 1 msg Message-ID: Hi Ernest, I am at Boundary Bay Airport just outside Vancouver BC. Vans is partly correct, you need to make a new plate .063 for the bottom of the carb, but the problem is you cannot fit the box with the filter in place, the nose wheel leg is in the way...(great if you have a 9) The solution is to cut of the rear half of the box as a separate piece, fitted on with nutplates . I will take some digital pictures for you.. As far as the baffles are concerned, the mounting holes in the heads are in a different location, and the diameter of the cylinder barrels is different, you would probably be better of getting patterns from an 0-235. These are the only 2 ares that gave me problems, the baffles being the easiest. I will kep you posted. Bob. From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Dec 12 08:17:30 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] RF-6 Kit For Sale Message-ID: <20021212081631.G68709-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> There's an RV-6 kit for sale on the Wing web site that looks like a good deal, to me. Go to http://www.vansairforce.org/classifieds/ it's about the third ad down the page. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From 6430 at axion.net Thu Dec 12 10:09:51 2002 From: 6430 at axion.net (Austin) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] RF-6 Kit For Sale References: <20021212081631.G68709-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> Message-ID: <005401c2a209$ad66dc40$1d91c2cf@default> Hey Tedd, It's only 10 a.m. and you must be finished work already....playing on the computer..... I am sitting here looking at the weather and seeing trees waving around, knowing it is not the best day to fly, and I only have 2 hours left before getting my 25 in....I am getting antsy.... Do you get out to Langley on the weekends ?....don't see you around..maybe that is a good thing...pound rivets you know.... Austin. ----- Original Message ----- From: Tedd McHenry To: Western Canada Wing List Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2002 8:17 AM Subject: [Wing] RF-6 Kit For Sale > There's an RV-6 kit for sale on the Wing web site that looks like a good deal, > to me. Go to > > http://www.vansairforce.org/classifieds/ > > it's about the third ad down the page. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Dec 14 18:29:53 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Great RV Photo Message-ID: <20021214182821.B76330-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> Someone recently posted a terrific photo to the Wing web site of an RV-4 on a frozen lake. Go to http://www.vansairforce.org/photos/ and scroll down to the bottom of the page. Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From jjewell at telus.net Wed Dec 18 01:24:53 2002 From: jjewell at telus.net (Jim Jewell) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Battery prices Message-ID: <000801c2a677$52871a20$0a4bad8e@bc.hsia.telus.net> If you are looking for a good price on the Odyssey Battery line check this site. https://www.batteries4everything.com/index.html They have the best battery prices I've seen. Jim in Kelowna -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021218/87c80171/attachment.htm From acornyn at telusplanet.net Wed Dec 18 07:20:44 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Battery prices References: <000801c2a677$52871a20$0a4bad8e@bc.hsia.telus.net> Message-ID: <001501c2a6a9$09c31960$6e1db8a1@USER> Don't buy Odessey batteries. I bought two of them and they both failed the first time they got frozen . They wouldn't hold a charge for more than one day after that so I returned them and they charged me extra freight but would not warranty them. Now I have a wheel chair and it is just fine. Expensive lesson. Al Rv6 flying ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Jewell To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2002 2:24 AM Subject: [Wing] Battery prices If you are looking for a good price on the Odyssey Battery line check this site. https://www.batteries4everything.com/index.html They have the best battery prices I've seen. Jim in Kelowna -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021218/953996a5/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Dec 18 08:56:42 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Battery prices In-Reply-To: <001501c2a6a9$09c31960$6e1db8a1@USER> Message-ID: <20021218085523.V6002-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> Al: > Don't buy Odessey batteries. I bought two of them and they both failed the first time they got frozen . I may be missing something, but is there a battery that will work after it has been frozen? And why would you want that feature? Tedd McHenry From robert.mccallum2 at sympatico.ca Wed Dec 18 15:58:27 2002 From: robert.mccallum2 at sympatico.ca (Robert McCallum) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Battery prices References: <000801c2a677$52871a20$0a4bad8e@bc.hsia.telus.net> <001501c2a6a9$09c31960$6e1db8a1@USER> Message-ID: <3E010BA3.1EE611A6@sympatico.ca> Al; What would you expect to happen to a battery if you let it freeze? I don't think that there are any batteries that will stand up to that kind of abuse. If it's in such a poor state of charge that it freezes then I would expect that the plates would be pretty badly damaged or distorted by the ice and might even become shorted. Certainly have never see a battery which worked satisfactorily after being frozen. Can't see how you can blame a manufacturer for that kind of failure. -- Bob McC DO NOT ARCHIVE From: "Al Cornyn" 10:20 Subject: Re: [Wing] Battery prices To: Don't buy Odessey batteries. I bought two of them and they both failed the first time they got frozen . They wouldn't hold a charge for more than one day after that so I returned them and they charged me extra freight but would not warranty them. Now I have a wheel chair and it is just fine. Expensive lesson. Al Rv6 flying From brjaques at pris.ca Wed Dec 18 18:27:06 2002 From: brjaques at pris.ca (Bruce Jaques) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Gel cells References: <000801c2a677$52871a20$0a4bad8e@bc.hsia.telus.net> <001501c2a6a9$09c31960$6e1db8a1@USER> <3E010BA3.1EE611A6@sympatico.ca> Message-ID: <001501c2a706$20a4aa60$1bdcf4cc@brucejaques> I told the story about freezing my gel cell wheel chair battery. It froze and I thawed it for a few days, then charged it and it load tested just fine. Worked ok in the plane, too. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021218/6cd5b720/attachment.htm From haywire at telus.net Wed Dec 18 23:03:36 2002 From: haywire at telus.net (Haywire) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Gel cells In-Reply-To: <001501c2a706$20a4aa60$1bdcf4cc@brucejaques> Message-ID: Hi Bruce; I bought a wheelchair battery for my project as well after a friend had a battery fail while he was visiting. We went to a local battery warehouse and knowing they wouldn't have aircraft batteries, we just looked at all their stock for something suitable to get him home when we spotted the recombinant gas wheelchair battery, which was perfect size. After he had put it through a few good tests and determined that it was more than sufficient for continued service, I asked on the AeroElectric list for comments. Electric Bob replied that it would be fine, so I bought one, but a few offline replies indicated that it was an "odd" idea. I bought one (33ah) and have used it in my project as a power supply while testing system installations including an electric engine waterpump, which many claimed would kill the battery within 15 min after alternator failure. I left it pumping coolant through my system, powered by the wheelchair battery only, for more than 2 hours one night, then an additional several hours over the next week. Voltage only dropped to 10.5 volts before I put a charger on it. I give the RG wheelchair batteries two thumbs up ! S. Todd Bartrim Turbo 13B rotary powered RV-9endurance (FWF) C-FSTB http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm "If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you always got." -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On Behalf Of Bruce Jaques Sent: December 18, 2002 6:27 PM To: wing@vansairforce.org Subject: Re: [Wing] Gel cells I told the story about freezing my gel cell wheel chair battery. It froze and I thawed it for a few days, then charged it and it load tested just fine. Worked ok in the plane, too. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.427 / Virus Database: 240 - Release Date: 06/12/02 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021218/8f9461cc/attachment.htm From acornyn at telusplanet.net Thu Dec 19 07:09:26 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Battery prices References: <20021218085523.V6002-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> Message-ID: <000d01c2a770$a01b13a0$441ab8a1@USER> Wheel chair battery, not wheel chair sorry. Where I live, it is not uncommon to see minus 30 degrees.It is nice to have the battery recover and still be useable unlike Odessey batteries of my experience. You must have lots of money if you can afford to replace your battery every time it gets cold. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2002 9:56 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] Battery prices > Al: > > > Don't buy Odessey batteries. I bought two of them and they both failed the first time they got frozen . > > I may be missing something, but is there a battery that will work after it has > been frozen? And why would you want that feature? > > Tedd McHenry > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From wjoke at shaw.ca Thu Dec 19 09:18:30 2002 From: wjoke at shaw.ca (Jim Oke) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Battery prices References: <20021218085523.V6002-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> <000d01c2a770$a01b13a0$441ab8a1@USER> Message-ID: <002601c2a782$a70365c0$6401a8c0@cd708596a> Hmm; I have an Odessey battery in my RV project and the temperature certainly drops below freezing "just occasionally" here in Winnipeg. So after awhile longer in the shop, I'll be able to report one way or another about Odessey batteries and cold weather when I start flying. Jim Oke RV-6A Winnipeg,(aka Winterpeg and the subject of many bad CBC jokes about cold weather, mosquitoes, mud, etc.) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Al Cornyn" To: Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 9:09 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] Battery prices > Wheel chair battery, not wheel chair sorry. Where I live, it is not > uncommon to see minus 30 degrees.It is nice to have the battery recover and > still be useable unlike Odessey batteries of my experience. You must have > lots of money if you can afford to replace your battery every time it gets > cold. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tedd McHenry" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2002 9:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Wing] Battery prices > > > > Al: > > > > > Don't buy Odessey batteries. I bought two of them and they both failed > the first time they got frozen . > > > > I may be missing something, but is there a battery that will work after it > has > > been frozen? And why would you want that feature? > > > > Tedd McHenry > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From robert.mccallum2 at sympatico.ca Thu Dec 19 17:10:16 2002 From: robert.mccallum2 at sympatico.ca (Robert McCallum) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Battery prices References: <20021218085523.V6002-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> <000d01c2a770$a01b13a0$441ab8a1@USER> Message-ID: <3E026DF8.39026751@sympatico.ca> Al Cornyn wrote: > > Wheel chair battery, not wheel chair sorry. Where I live, it is not > uncommon to see minus 30 degrees.It is nice to have the battery recover and > still be useable unlike Odessey batteries of my experience. You must have > lots of money if you can afford to replace your battery every time it gets > cold. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Tedd McHenry" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, December 18, 2002 9:56 AM > Subject: Re: [Wing] Battery prices > > > Al: > > > > > Don't buy Odessey batteries. I bought two of them and they both failed > the first time they got frozen . > > > > I may be missing something, but is there a battery that will work after it > has > > been frozen? And why would you want that feature? > > > > Tedd McHenry > > Al; I think you may have misled several of us when you stated you "froze" your battery. Minus 30 degrees will not freeze a properly charged battery. I think in your original statement you meant that it got cold, which is vastly different than freezing it. The electrolyte in a fully charged battery, will not freeze until it gets down to about minus 92.0 degrees fahrenheit. I think this original basic misunderstanding of your terminology is what led both Tedd and I to wonder why you would expect a "frozen" battery to function. I live in the "Great White North" and can ensure you from personal experience that as low as Minus 68 Degrees F batteries still function, but not if they are frozen. A discharged battery on the other hand can "freeze" at temperatures as high as Plus 25 degrees F. -- Bob McC DO NOT ARCHIVE From Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca Fri Dec 20 08:51:53 2002 From: Bob_Cutting at toyota.ca (Bob_Cutting@toyota.ca) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] Battery prices Message-ID: I,ve been using wheel chair batteries for years, the best one is the German Sonessheim, they are readily available and reasonably priced at cost of $85 (Canadian Dollars)......but dont mention you are putting it into an aircraft, they wont sell it to you!! From abajangirl at shaw.ca Tue Dec 24 16:20:05 2002 From: abajangirl at shaw.ca (anna cutting) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:21 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV9A Message-ID: <005901c2abab$60961100$0a324418@vc.shawcable.net> Skipped content of type multipart/alternative-------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: Roy Taylor Subject: The RV Grin Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 12:06:48 -0800 Size: 289186 Url: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021224/7fa02ef1/attachment.eml -------------- next part -------------- An embedded message was scrubbed... From: Roy Taylor Subject: (no subject) Date: Sun, 22 Dec 2002 12:13:05 -0800 Size: 152666 Url: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021224/7fa02ef1/attachment-0001.eml From ham at hammcc.com Tue Dec 24 19:01:52 2002 From: ham at hammcc.com (Hamilton McClymont) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:22 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV9A In-Reply-To: <005901c2abab$60961100$0a324418@vc.shawcable.net> Message-ID: What a Christmas present Bob! have a merry one! Cheers, Hammy -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On Behalf Of anna cutting Sent: December 24, 2002 4:20 PM To: wing@vansairforce.org Subject: [Wing] RV9A I am very pleased to report that I test flew my RV9A (C-FRVC) on Dec 22nd at Boundary Bay Airport (after 15 months building time) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021224/b9bc7ede/attachment.htm From ve7fp at jetstream.net Tue Dec 24 18:57:23 2002 From: ve7fp at jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:22 2005 Subject: [Wing] FW: Emailing: Ode to an RV Christmas Message-ID: <001201c2abc1$63a7e2e0$20897240@cs> I included this in the January issue of the 1998 Western Canada Rvator while I was editor. I think it appropriate to send it again. Ken -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Ode to an RV Christmas.doc Type: application/msword Size: 36352 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021224/0ccbab4d/OdetoanRVChristmas.doc From mdeg at shaw.ca Thu Dec 26 15:24:03 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:22 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV9A References: <005901c2abab$60961100$0a324418@vc.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <001b01c2ad35$e0ab7480$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> Congratulations on the first flight........great pictures of an awesome looking airplane..... Marc DeGirolamo ----- Original Message ----- From: anna cutting To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Tuesday, December 24, 2002 6:20 PM Subject: [Wing] RV9A I am very pleased to report that I test flew my RV9A (C-FRVC) on Dec 22nd at Boundary Bay Airport (after 15 months building time) As you may know, it is the first RV9A to fly with the 0-290 engine, am I pleased or what!! I have 3.5hrs on it and am overjoyed with its performance. Having previosly built and flown an RV6A with the 0-320 engine, I can honoustly say that the performance of this RV9A exceeds that of my 6A. the climb rate solo, indicating 105mph is 1500fpm at 2350 rpm ( new Roncz airfoil!) and cruise at 2450 shows 160mph IAS (1500ft) obviously at altitude, TAS is going to be pretty much what Vans calls for (but with the 0-320) The bottom line is, that it appears there is little or no appreciable decrease in performance on the smaller 140 HP engine and with a significant savings in fuel... That being said, my 0-290 has LSI electronic ignition, a tuned exhaust and carefully balance parts, so it might be putting out a tad more than a used engine, but then so was my 320. I will start to do some calibration work to verify the actual readings, so I hope to have good data by the time I have finished flying of the 25hrs test time. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20021226/7d3b58c6/attachment.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Dec 27 17:56:51 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:22 2005 Subject: [Wing] Engine Hoist - Vancouver BC Area Message-ID: <20021227175542.C81194-100000@strongbad.retrix.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 12:01:33 -0800 From: Norman Reply-To: rv-list@matronics.com To: rocket-list@matronics.com, rv-list@matronics.com Subject: RV-List: Engine Hoist - Vancouver BC Area --> RV-List message posted by: "Norman" Hi Listers, I just scored a 5 ton hydralic engine hoist a few days ago and wanted to offer it out to any RV/Rocket builders in my area. This thing is huge. It has two different lifting arms for the front, one for low clearance and a regular straight one. Actuation is by a hand pump deal simular to a bottle jack but much bigger. I've also got a selection of chains and straps. The whole thing pins together so it fits inside my Expedition no problem. Would go inside a mini van with no seats. The only thing I ask for is an hour of dual if you fly before me but I will recipricate and provide an hour dual for you if I beat you to first flight. For two hours I will deliver and retrieve the hoist. Please plan your engine installation to limit use to a one week period if you are doing it in CASCAR's racing season because I need quick access to it when the heat is on. Winter months it can go out for longer periods. Norman Hunger RV6A Delta BC From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Jan 2 17:27:53 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question Message-ID: Does anybody have any good tips for deburring holes in tight places? I'm thinking of locations such as the insides of control-surface ribs near the tip, where there's no room to get a normal deburring tool in. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From wjoke at shaw.ca Wed Jan 2 18:14:57 2002 From: wjoke at shaw.ca (Jim Oke) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question References: Message-ID: <00a201c193fc$88dcd4e0$6401a8c0@cd708596a> Hi Tedd, All I did was use a very thin flat file to get the worst of the chips from drilling the hole off. Then some scotchbrite to generally smooth things over. Not a true "countersunk" deburr, but more of a "best available" solution. Try Cdn Tire or Princess Auto for a "needle" file set. A few dollars for a set of 6 or 8 small files. Handy for doing odd corners and angles throughout the project. One tip, use fluting pliers or similar to open up the rib flange to get your dimpling set or whatever in place, dimple to taste, then re-bend the flange to 90 deg. Also if the skin holes are not drilled as yet, try and offset the top & bottom surface holes towards the aft end of the rib by 3/16 - 1/4 in or so. This will be a help when it comes time to try and rivet in this area. A Princess Auto "splitting wedge", normally used for chopping up logs for your fireplace, is a reasonable substitute for a normal bucking bar in this area too. The pop rivet route is another way to go. Jim Oke CYWG ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" <> To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2002 7:27 PM Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question > Does anybody have any good tips for deburring holes in tight places? I'm > thinking of locations such as the insides of control-surface ribs near the tip, > where there's no room to get a normal deburring tool in. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Jan 2 18:32:39 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question Message-ID: Jim: Exellent suggestions, thanks! I wish I'd heard of that splitting wedge idea a while ago. I spent hours grinding a tapered bucking bar from raw stock, and I already have a splitting wedge in my garage! Tedd From mdeg at shaw.ca Wed Jan 2 19:39:45 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question References: Message-ID: <006e01c19408$8e262bc0$05e64218@ss.shawcable.net> Hi Ted.......I used a .025 feeler guage to debur alot of holes when nothing else would work......It is stiff enough and the edge is sharp enough to cut the bur off the edge of the hole (which is all you really have to do anyway). A piece of emery cloth or scotchbrite will finish the job.... Marc DeGirolamo C-FRVE ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, January 02, 2002 7:27 PM Subject: [Wing] Deburring Question > Does anybody have any good tips for deburring holes in tight places? I'm > thinking of locations such as the insides of control-surface ribs near the tip, > where there's no room to get a normal deburring tool in. > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Jan 4 09:47:34 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In Message-ID: The Langley Aero Club (LAC) is planning an RV fly-in this summer, at Langley airport (CYNJ). I'd like to find out what sorts of things Wing members would like to see at the fly-in. LAC has several things already in mind: o RV training with Mike Seager o a "people's choice" award for the best RV o seminars or presentations on RV building and flying o food of some kind Do these ideas appeal to you? What are your preferences? What other events or activities would you like to see? If you're outside the Fraser Valley area, what sorts of things would motivate you to come to the Langley fly-in? If there are seminars or presentations, what topics would you like to see covered? You can write me directly at the address below, or reply to this list, with your ideas. Thanks, Tedd --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From reagleston at ibigroup.com Fri Jan 4 10:56:22 2002 From: reagleston at ibigroup.com (Ron Eagleston) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ted, As I am hoping to have my 8A completed within the next 10 months training with Mike Seager would be a great option. Ron Ron Eagleston IBI Group reagleston@ibigroup.com tel. (604) 683-8797 fax. (604) 683-0492 NOTE: This e-mail message and attachments may contain privileged and confidential information. If you have received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender and delete this e-mail message. > From: Tedd McHenry > Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org > Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2002 09:47:34 -0800 (PST) > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In > > > The Langley Aero Club (LAC) is planning an RV fly-in this summer, at Langley > airport (CYNJ). I'd like to find out what sorts of things Wing members would > like to see at the fly-in. LAC has several things already in mind: > > o RV training with Mike Seager o a "people's choice" award for the best RV o > seminars or presentations on RV building and flying o food of some kind > > Do these ideas appeal to you? What are your preferences? What other events > or > activities would you like to see? If you're outside the Fraser Valley area, > what sorts of things would motivate you to come to the Langley fly-in? If > there are seminars or presentations, what topics would you like to see > covered? > > You can write me directly at the address below, or reply to this list, with > your ideas. > > Thanks, > > Tedd > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From fvalarm at rapidnet.net Fri Jan 4 11:50:25 2002 From: fvalarm at rapidnet.net (B. Tomm) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In References: Message-ID: <001701c19559$0ef8d120$aa8d35d1@cheryls> Tedd I'm very interested in attending (if not assisting) keep me informed. Bevan Abbotsford starting wings RV7A From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Jan 4 12:25:53 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Email Address Help Message-ID: I have incorrect email addresses for the following Wing members. If you have the correct address for any of them, please send it to me so I can revise the membership list. Jensen, David Kelowna , BC drjensen@uniserve.com Sager, Jim Chilliwack, BC jsager@uniserve.com Mead, Jim Kamloops, BC Jim_Mead@bc.sympatico.ca Demchuk, Clarence Regina, SK ced912@hotmail.com Cox, Ken Sardis, BC ken_maxine_cox@hotmail.com Strike, TK. Sanford, NC www.eliteagency242@bellsouth.net Loewen, Burton Steinbach, MB stefurn@login.mb.sympatico.ca Gervais, Paul Olds, AB paul.gervais@gov.ab.ca Hurlbut, Steve Lazo, BC shurlbut@island.net Woodard, Don Spokane, WA aerorivit@netscape.net Thanks, Tedd --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From rdkennett at shaw.ca Sat Jan 5 22:40:42 2002 From: rdkennett at shaw.ca (Della & Robert Kennett) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In References: Message-ID: <000901c1967d$1087d3e0$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Tedd: This sounds like a great idea. Do you know yet when it will happen? With some luck, I might even be able to fly my 6A down to it. I should have the first flight by early summer, or perhaps sooner depending how the fibreglass work goes... If you have some seminars, one that my wife would be interested in is "what to take for overnight camping in an RV?". We used to enjoy going over to Texada or Tofino in the 172 and hope to do similar trips in the RV. Rob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: January 4, 2002 9:47 AM Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-In > The Langley Aero Club (LAC) is planning an RV fly-in this summer, at Langley > airport (CYNJ). I'd like to find out what sorts of things Wing members would > like to see at the fly-in. LAC has several things already in mind: > > o RV training with Mike Seager o a "people's choice" award for the best RV o > seminars or presentations on RV building and flying o food of some kind > > Do these ideas appeal to you? What are your preferences? What other events or > activities would you like to see? If you're outside the Fraser Valley area, > what sorts of things would motivate you to come to the Langley fly-in? If > there are seminars or presentations, what topics would you like to see covered? > > You can write me directly at the address below, or reply to this list, with > your ideas. > > Thanks, > > Tedd > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Jan 9 22:30:44 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Operating Instructions and Checklists Message-ID: I've just made some long-overdue additions to the Wing web site, under the section "RV Operating Instructions and Checklists." We now have: RV-6A Pilot's Operating Handbook -------------------------------- by Scott Gesele formats: HTML; MS Word (4.6 MB); PDF (3.8 MB) RV-4 Pilot's Operating Handbook ------------------------------- (original author unknown) formats: HTML; MS Word (5.8 MB); PDF (2.7 MB) RV Flight Test Log Cards ------------------------ by Randy Pflanzer and Clay Smith formats: HTML; MS Word Roger Hopkinson's Pilot Operating Handbook ------------------------------------------ (link to another site) Homer Rogers's Annual Inspection Procedure ------------------------------------------ by Homer Rogers formats: HTML; MS Word (37 KB); PDF (82 KB) --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From rdkennett at shaw.ca Sat Jan 12 09:10:53 2002 From: rdkennett at shaw.ca (Della & Robert Kennett) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Microballoons Message-ID: <001801c19b8c$17fbf700$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> I have a couple of small dents that I would like to fill. Early in my project, the inspector said that if I had some inperfections (I didn't have any at that time....) , they could be filled with microballoons. Is this good advice? What sort of preparation would be needed? Should the surface be primed first or would scuffing/etching be sufficient? The other product I have considered is Superfil, but I already have some epoxy resin and microballoons for the fibreglass work. Thanks Rob Kennett, Westbank BC RV6A (wiring and other loose ends) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020112/d477ffa8/attachment-0001.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Jan 12 17:04:45 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] 2002 Schedule of Events Message-ID: Thanks to Ken Hoshowski, we now have a schedule of fly-ins and other aviation events for BC on the Wing web site. You can see it at http://www.vansairforce.org/events/fly-in-out_2002.html If you'd like to add an event to this schedule, for western Canada or nearby states, please send the information to me (tedd@vansairforce.org). --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From mdeg at shaw.ca Sat Jan 12 19:07:13 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Microballoons References: <001801c19b8c$17fbf700$f4aa4318@ok.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <004201c19bdf$66a3aee0$05e64218@ss.shawcable.net> If the dent is in the aluminum I would just use a automotive type of filler such as bondo or any other lightweight filler......clean and scuff aluminum first and apply.....sand smoth with a block sander, feathering all edges. Epoxy with microballoons is OK too, but will want to slump as epoxy takes longer to set up than polyester resins......mix to the consistency of dry peanut butter and apply. Marc RV-4....flying ----- Original Message ----- From: Della & Robert Kennett To: wing@vansairforce.org Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 11:10 AM Subject: [Wing] Microballoons I have a couple of small dents that I would like to fill. Early in my project, the inspector said that if I had some inperfections (I didn't have any at that time....) , they could be filled with microballoons. Is this good advice? What sort of preparation would be needed? Should the surface be primed first or would scuffing/etching be sufficient? The other product I have considered is Superfil, but I already have some epoxy resin and microballoons for the fibreglass work. Thanks Rob Kennett, Westbank BC RV6A (wiring and other loose ends) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020112/3950d3b0/attachment-0001.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Jan 15 15:00:59 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Help With Your C of A Application Message-ID: Thanks to Terry Elgood, MD-RA Regional Chief Inspector for BC, we now have a new feature on the Wing web site. It's an article Terry wrote that is intented to help you work your way through the calculations on Form 24-0079. If you're at that stage in your project, give it a try and let me know if it helps. Also, please pass on any errors you find, or suggestions you have to improve it. Terry wrote up the calculations, and I've checked it for typos, but there's always the possibility of something slipping through. Tedd --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From acornyn at telusplanet.net Tue Jan 15 18:32:49 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Brag References: Message-ID: <000701c19e36$17bd5070$231db8a1@USER> My nineteen year ol daughter soloed today! I'm the proud Dad. I think that I am more excited than she is.. If any one wants to abuse her, her email is kran@mailcity.com Al RV-6 flying From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 6:04 PM Subject: [Wing] 2002 Schedule of Events > Thanks to Ken Hoshowski, we now have a schedule of fly-ins and other aviation > events for BC on the Wing web site. You can see it at > > http://www.vansairforce.org/events/fly-in-out_2002.html > > If you'd like to add an event to this schedule, for western Canada or nearby > states, please send the information to me (tedd@vansairforce.org). > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Wed Jan 16 06:07:54 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:33 2005 Subject: [Wing] Brag References: <000701c19e36$17bd5070$231db8a1@USER> Message-ID: <000b01c19e97$31d3d0e0$7a1ab8a1@dgmurray> Al - You will have to start wearing T-shirts so you won't pop your buttons ! What an awesome accomplishment for her. Did she do it in the RV? If so then you might HAVE to build another bird just so you will hve something to flt:-)) Soon you Thursday, Doug. ----- Original Message ----- From: Al Cornyn To: Sent: Tuesday, January 15, 2002 7:32 PM Subject: [Wing] Brag > My nineteen year ol daughter soloed today! I'm the proud Dad. I think that > I am more excited than she is.. If any one wants to abuse her, her email is > kran@mailcity.com Al RV-6 flying > From: "Tedd McHenry" > To: "Western Canada Wing List" > Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2002 6:04 PM > Subject: [Wing] 2002 Schedule of Events > > > > Thanks to Ken Hoshowski, we now have a schedule of fly-ins and other > aviation > > events for BC on the Wing web site. You can see it at > > > > http://www.vansairforce.org/events/fly-in-out_2002.html > > > > If you'd like to add an event to this schedule, for western Canada or > nearby > > states, please send the information to me (tedd@vansairforce.org). > > > > --- > > > > Tedd McHenry > > Van's Air Force > > Western Canada Wing > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From acwrench at yahoo.ca Thu Jan 24 08:50:49 2002 From: acwrench at yahoo.ca (pat morency) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: wing thing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020124165049.65866.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> Has anyone recently completed or in the process of completing the wings on an RV-6. I have some questions regarding the flap brace and when it is installed. Also does the stub rib have to be put in with 9 rivets ( 5 from the aileron bracket and 4 flush on the rear spar Thanks for the feed back. Pat Morency --- Tedd McHenry wrote: > Pat: > > I can't think of anyone currently working on the > wings, off the top of my head. > I'm just about to start the wings. But there are > lots of people on the list > who have completed -6 wings. You might try sending > out a question to the list. > Just send an email to wing@vansairforce.org. Your > questions are bound to spark > an interesting discussion. > > What sort of problems have you run into? Whatever > they are, I'm sure I'll be > facing them soon, too. > > Tedd > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > On Tue, 22 Jan 2002, pat morency wrote: > > > Tedd, > > Do you know of anyone in your mailing list who is > now > > working on their wing set of an RV6. I seem to be > > running into a wall in a few areas. > > Thanks, > > Pat Morency/Calgary > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! > http://website.yahoo.ca > > > ______________________________________________________________________ Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca From wjoke at shaw.ca Thu Jan 24 12:07:31 2002 From: wjoke at shaw.ca (Jim Oke) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: wing thing References: <20020124165049.65866.qmail@web11908.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001e01c1a512$c223b940$6401a8c0@cd708596a> Hi Pat (and Tedd); I finished my wings about six months ago (well, I'm at the 99% stage and holding) so perhaps I can comment. The flap brace can be left fairly late in the game but some preparation early on will help. Try and predict where flap brace rivets in the aft spar will fall and then leave the rib-to-rear spar rivets at these locations undrilled until fitting the flap brace. You want to drill through the flap brace, the rear spar, and a wing rib (aft flange) together to avoid extra holes that are close together. I riveted the bottom skins on, then fitted and riveted the flap brace and then riveted the top skin on (after my DABA inspection.) The plans are not that descriptive at the root end of the spar brace - where it over laps the extra 1/8" doubler for the 5/16 spar bolt location. Check the photos in the manual for an idea of how the cut out in this area goes. Again, avoid drilling the doubler to aft spar holes in the flap brace area too early. These should be drilled as one if at all possible. There is a tendency to let the let the brace get "pushed down" in this area which will cause a bend in the flap hinge line - use a straight edge on the lower surface to avoid. This may mean that the top edge of the brace will require some notches to be filed in it to clear the top row of rivets in the doubler. While on the subject of the aft spar, also look ahead to the aileron gap seal installation. Rib-to-spar hole drilling is not a problem but the lower rivets should be 426s vice 470s to have a smooth surface for the bottom of the gap seal to rest on. The stub rib needs some care in drilling the holes. I would suggest a few 3/32 flush rivets spaced in between the "final" 1/8 rivets to hold things in place. (The plans show this for the outer bracket already). If you are able to get along with clamps only in this area until drilling the inner aileron bracket, that would be even better. Assuming you have the PP skins, then the skins will determine the rib's location and the rib-to-spar rivets are less of a factor. The "final" five 1/8 bracket-to-spar rivets will be ample strength to hold the stub rib in place - no need for the "standard" four rivets the other ribs require as well. BTW, I drilled the outer bracket first and then used my completed ailerons (with the hinge fittings installed on the brackets with the spacers and other hardware) to set the location of the inner bracket. I don't think I even bothered measuring anything spanwise. Vertical location does count though so pay some attention to this to preserve the airfoil shape. Try and get a look at a flying RV-6 to get a feel for the size and shape of aileron pushrod hole in the spar. The plans are quite far off of this - a kidney shaped hole angling up and in to almost the top spar flange is actually needed vice a square hole lower down per dwg 21. Cut early and large and you will save a lot of tedious labour later on. Make it good and big - that's why the big .063 doubter is there. Glad to help with more questions, as you have them. Jim Oke Wpg RV-3 (flies sometimes) RV-6A (wiring & cowl stuff) ----- Original Message ----- From: "pat morency" To: "Tedd McHenry" Cc: Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2002 10:50 AM Subject: [Wing] Re: wing thing > Has anyone recently completed or in the process of > completing the wings on an RV-6. I have some questions > regarding the flap brace and when it is installed. > Also does the stub rib have to be put in with 9 rivets > ( 5 from the aileron bracket and 4 flush on the rear > spar > Thanks for the feed back. > Pat Morency > --- Tedd McHenry wrote: > > Pat: > > > > I can't think of anyone currently working on the > > wings, off the top of my head. > > I'm just about to start the wings. But there are > > lots of people on the list > > who have completed -6 wings. You might try sending > > out a question to the list. > > Just send an email to wing@vansairforce.org. Your > > questions are bound to spark > > an interesting discussion. > > > > What sort of problems have you run into? Whatever > > they are, I'm sure I'll be > > facing them soon, too. > > > > Tedd > > > > --- > > > > Tedd McHenry > > Van's Air Force > > Western Canada Wing > > tedd@vansairforce.org > > www.vansairforce.org > > > > On Tue, 22 Jan 2002, pat morency wrote: > > > > > Tedd, > > > Do you know of anyone in your mailing list who is > > now > > > working on their wing set of an RV6. I seem to be > > > running into a wall in a few areas. > > > Thanks, > > > Pat Morency/Calgary > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > > > > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! > > http://website.yahoo.ca > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Feb 1 14:04:16 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] ANR Headset Comparison Message-ID: Thanks to Rob Prior, we have a new article on the Wing web site comparing four popular models of ANR headsets: the David Clark 10-13XL, Flightcom Denali, Lightspeed 20XL, and Lightspeed QFR Cross Country. Rob and his cohorts performed detailed labratory and in-flight tests of the headsets. It's a good read, and very valuable information if you're in the market for headsets. http://www.vansairforce.org/misc/headsets/ --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From wordeng at telus.net Sat Feb 2 16:07:01 2002 From: wordeng at telus.net (George Worden) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP Message-ID: After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear but the starter is toast. Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, the starter was not loose on its mounts. George Worden From tedd at vansairforce.org Sat Feb 2 15:45:08 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP In-Reply-To: Message-ID: George: > It appears that somehow the starter pinion > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. I'm wondering if the chain of events was the reverse, i.e. the starter casting cracked, allowing the pinion to climb out of the ring gear. There is a considerable force spreading those gears apart when the pinion is driving the ring gear. There's even more if the pinion doesn't disengage soon enough, so that the ring gear drives the pinion momentarily. The starter housing may have developed a fatigue crack that eventually spread far enough to allow the gears to push themselves apart. It's also possible that the pinion had not been disengaging properly for a while, which might have led to the fatigue crack in the first place. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org On Sun, 3 Feb 2002, George Worden wrote: > After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the > starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear > but the starter is toast. > Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, the > starter was not loose on its mounts. > > George Worden > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From 2w at telus.net Sat Feb 2 16:43:15 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (Bill Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: Message-ID: <001201c1ac4b$d03a7060$ace8b440@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello George There is a a sky-tec starter new on www. e-bay.com present bid is $192.00 USD. Regards Bill Robson From ebowhay at jetstream.net Sat Feb 2 20:23:46 2002 From: ebowhay at jetstream.net (Eustace Bowhay) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: Message-ID: <000001c1ac6b$b78af560$acbb17cf@ebowhay> Hi George: Had a crack start near one of the bolts on my original starter some years back. As I recall I called Sky Tec and returned the starter to them and they replaced it with one that had a heavier casting, believe they gave me some credit for the cracked one. Will try to run the paper trail down on this in the next day or so and let you know if I have the details right, in any event it wouldn't hurt to give them a call. Eustace ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Worden" To: Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 4:07 PM Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the > starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear > but the starter is toast. > Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, the > starter was not loose on its mounts. > > George Worden > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From wordeng at telus.net Sat Feb 2 20:24:03 2002 From: wordeng at telus.net (George Worden) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: <000001c1ac6b$b78af560$acbb17cf@ebowhay> Message-ID: <000a01c1ac6a$9d282810$f206b38e@ibmfb11191> Eustace: Thanks for the information.I will give them a call. However in this case there is no indication of a previous crack- just looks like a single overload. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eustace Bowhay" To: Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 9:23 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > Hi George: > > Had a crack start near one of the bolts on my original starter some years > back. As I recall I called Sky Tec and returned the starter to them and > they replaced it with one that had a heavier casting, believe they gave me > some credit for the cracked one. > > Will try to run the paper trail down on this in the next day or so and let > you know if I have the details right, in any event it wouldn't hurt to give > them a call. > > Eustace > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "George Worden" > To: > Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 4:07 PM > Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > > > > After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the > > starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion > > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear > > but the starter is toast. > > Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, > the > > starter was not loose on its mounts. > > > > George Worden > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From jayeandscott at shaw.ca Sat Feb 2 23:34:43 2002 From: jayeandscott at shaw.ca (Jaye and Scott Jackson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: Message-ID: <01ff01c1ac85$41398100$0200a8c0@vc.shawcable.net> Is there any chance that the starter gear was not the same tooth pitch as the ring gear. I know they come in two sizes and I don't even know if they can be bolted together if they're not.... Scott in Vancouver Thanks for the ride last summer and talking me through my back-seat landing.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Worden" To: Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 4:07 PM Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > After 490 hours and maybe 2000 starts I had a massive failure- broke the > starter casting right off. It appears that somehow the starter pinion > managed to climb up on top of the ring gear. Minor scars to the ring gear > but the starter is toast. > Any other experience out there? Any idea how this could happen? And no, the > starter was not loose on its mounts. > > George Worden > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From tedd at mchenry.ca Sat Feb 2 21:24:50 2002 From: tedd at mchenry.ca (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP In-Reply-To: <000a01c1ac6a$9d282810$f206b38e@ibmfb11191> Message-ID: > However in > this case there is no indication of a previous crack- just looks like a > single overload. George: In that case, my guess for a cause would be that a piece of debris got in between the gears and forced them apart. I've heard of that spliting a whole transmission in two; if so it could definitely crack your starter housing. Tedd From hwregget at shaw.ca Sun Feb 3 09:49:50 2002 From: hwregget at shaw.ca (Harv Wregget) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Jabiru Engines References: Message-ID: <007201c1acdb$2deb5fa0$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> Tedd McHenry, I read your message on Jabiru Engines last year and now I wonder if you might offer an opinion on the aero diesel engine under development now. Except for possible cold weather starting problems, it sounds ideal to me. Am I missing something? Here is the link: http://www.deltahawkengines.com/econom00.htm Thanks, Harv Wregget From tedd at vansairforce.org Sun Feb 3 10:46:06 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re: Jabiru Engines In-Reply-To: <007201c1acdb$2deb5fa0$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> Message-ID: Harv: I haven't been following the DeltaHawk, specifically, all that closely. But I think diesel aircraft engines have a very strong future. There's a good article about some of the European diesel aircraft engines in the November, 2001 issue of Flyer, a magazine from the UK. Reading between the lines, it appears that diesel aircraft engines are a done deal, so far as the Europeans are concerned. Because of the diesel's greater efficiency, and especially because of the fuel taxes in Europe, the cost savings with a diesel are enormous over there. However, the economics of diesels in North America is quite different. Europeans are prepared to pay more, up front, for a diesel engine, with the promise of significantly lower operating costs. The European diesel manufacturers aren't claiming that they can match the up-front price of a Lycoming. In North America, however, with a much lower cost of fuel, customers are more interested in up-front cost. This is particularly true in the homebuilt market. It appears that a lot of what drives the experimental engine movement in North America is the goal of lower up-front cost than a Lycoming, or perhaps better performance for the same cost. Consider the two most popular new engines for RVs, the Chevy V6 and the Mazda rotary. Neither engine can match a Lycoming's fuel efficiency. But either one can give you similar performance for less money or, in the case of the rotary, and with some engineering, better performance for about the same money. The goal of the NASA/GAP diesel engine program is somewhere between the European model and the V6/rotary model. They're aiming to keep the cost down through lower parts count (and government-subsidized development!), and gain the fuel efficiency advantages of a diesel for about the same up-front cost as a Lycoming, maybe a bit lower. I don't know where the DeltaHawk fits into that picture. To be successful, I think they need to sell for not just less than list price for a Lycoming, but also less than the discounted price that most Lycoming customers get these days, through Van's, Lancair, Sequoia, or whomever. That will be very hard to do, since the development cost of a Lycoming is already amortized long ago. Also, the heavily discounted price that Van's and other companies get make it clear that Textron-Lycoming is milking the piston engine market, and will drop their list prices significantly if they ever get much competition. To me that makes what DeltaHawk is trying to do very difficult. I believe the best hope for a viable alternative to Lycomings in the 150-200 Hp range, which the homebuilt market badly needs, lies in two areas. The first is engines built overseas, in places with lower cost of production. The Jabiru is the best example I know of. With the Australian dollar hovering around 50 cents U.S., and using modern design and manufacturing techniques, Jabiru can produce a superior engine for less cost. They're already doing this in the 80-120 HP range. The new 180 HP engine will probably prove to be superior to a Lycoming also, and at a lower price, although it's obviously too early to claim that yet. The second place we'll get alternatives to Lycoming is in home-grown development of auto conversions, and the leading candidate there is the Mazda rotary. Rotary homebuilders are beginning to organize themselves along the lines of the open-source software movement. This is a very efficient way to do engineering development, and I have very high hope for this movement. In much the same way that open source software provides a viable alternative to the near-monopoly of Microsoft (including, for example, the software that runs this email group), a homebuilder-based movement of rotary engine deveopment could provide a viable alternative to the near-monopoly of Lycoming in the 150-200 HP engine market. As for the technical merit of the DeltaHawk engine, I can't really comment because I haven't looked at it that closely. Tedd From hwregget at shaw.ca Sun Feb 3 20:26:40 2002 From: hwregget at shaw.ca (Harv Wregget) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] DeltaHawk Diesel References: Message-ID: <000601c1ad34$24e55b00$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> Thanks for the quick reply Tedd. DeltaHawk plans to sell their 200 hp engine for $18,000 US, about 2/3 the cost of the IO360A2. It sounds too good to be true, but just in case their numbers prove correct, I have listed myself with them for delivery for no money down. Now I better get to work on a RV 8. Thanks again, Harv ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2002 10:46 AM Subject: Re: [Wing] Re: Jabiru Engines > Harv: > > I haven't been following the DeltaHawk, specifically, all that closely. But I > think diesel aircraft engines have a very strong future. There's a good > article about some of the European diesel aircraft engines in the November, > 2001 issue of Flyer, a magazine from the UK. Reading between the lines, it > appears that diesel aircraft engines are a done deal, so far as the Europeans > are concerned. Because of the diesel's greater efficiency, and especially > because of the fuel taxes in Europe, the cost savings with a diesel are > enormous over there. > > However, the economics of diesels in North America is quite different. > Europeans are prepared to pay more, up front, for a diesel engine, with the > promise of significantly lower operating costs. The European diesel > manufacturers aren't claiming that they can match the up-front price of a > Lycoming. In North America, however, with a much lower cost of fuel, customers > are more interested in up-front cost. This is particularly true in the > homebuilt market. It appears that a lot of what drives the experimental engine > movement in North America is the goal of lower up-front cost than a Lycoming, > or perhaps better performance for the same cost. Consider the two most popular > new engines for RVs, the Chevy V6 and the Mazda rotary. Neither engine can > match a Lycoming's fuel efficiency. But either one can give you similar > performance for less money or, in the case of the rotary, and with some > engineering, better performance for about the same money. > > The goal of the NASA/GAP diesel engine program is somewhere between the > European model and the V6/rotary model. They're aiming to keep the cost down > through lower parts count (and government-subsidized development!), and gain > the fuel efficiency advantages of a diesel for about the same up-front cost as > a Lycoming, maybe a bit lower. I don't know where the DeltaHawk fits into that > picture. To be successful, I think they need to sell for not just less than > list price for a Lycoming, but also less than the discounted price that most > Lycoming customers get these days, through Van's, Lancair, Sequoia, or > whomever. That will be very hard to do, since the development cost of a > Lycoming is already amortized long ago. Also, the heavily discounted price > that Van's and other companies get make it clear that Textron-Lycoming is > milking the piston engine market, and will drop their list prices significantly > if they ever get much competition. To me that makes what DeltaHawk is trying > to do very difficult. > > I believe the best hope for a viable alternative to Lycomings in the 150-200 Hp > range, which the homebuilt market badly needs, lies in two areas. The first is > engines built overseas, in places with lower cost of production. The Jabiru is > the best example I know of. With the Australian dollar hovering around 50 > cents U.S., and using modern design and manufacturing techniques, Jabiru can > produce a superior engine for less cost. They're already doing this in the > 80-120 HP range. The new 180 HP engine will probably prove to be superior to a > Lycoming also, and at a lower price, although it's obviously too early to claim > that yet. The second place we'll get alternatives to Lycoming is in home-grown > development of auto conversions, and the leading candidate there is the Mazda > rotary. Rotary homebuilders are beginning to organize themselves along the > lines of the open-source software movement. This is a very efficient way to do > engineering development, and I have very high hope for this movement. In much > the same way that open source software provides a viable alternative to the > near-monopoly of Microsoft (including, for example, the software that runs this > email group), a homebuilder-based movement of rotary engine deveopment could > provide a viable alternative to the near-monopoly of Lycoming in the 150-200 HP > engine market. > > As for the technical merit of the DeltaHawk engine, I can't really comment > because I haven't looked at it that closely. > > Tedd > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From hwregget at shaw.ca Sun Feb 3 20:38:09 2002 From: hwregget at shaw.ca (Harv Wregget) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Re-subscribe Message-ID: <002701c1ad35$bfe348a0$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> I think I am still on your member list, but I took myself off your mailing list last year due to all the junk mail and viruses. My e-mail has changed since then; I have changed from @home.com to @shaw.ca. I'd re-subscribe myself but I can't get into your site. I don't remember my password. Can you help? Harv Wregget -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020203/dfb08c2b/attachment-0001.htm From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Sun Feb 3 20:04:16 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP References: Message-ID: <001a01c1ad31$04a1cd40$be19b8a1@dgmurray> I hate to be the one that points to the real trouble - BUT- I have seen this many times and it happens right after someone inadvertantly engages the starter AFTER the engine is already running - usually right while they are checking the mags on run up and returning the key to the both position. If the key goes past the run postion and hits the start mode the drive gear will hit the ring gear and the nose housing gets broken. If the housing is lucky enough to survive then the armature windings may get spun off from being spun to fast. Hope this helps, Doug Murray C-GRPA Flying and up to 13 hours - I do wish the wind would calm down so I can aviate some more:-)) ----- Original Message ----- From: Tedd McHenry To: Sent: Saturday, February 02, 2002 10:24 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Sky Tec Starter model 149-12 PM -RV4, 180HP > > However in > > this case there is no indication of a previous crack- just looks like a > > single overload. > > George: > > In that case, my guess for a cause would be that a piece of debris got in > between the gears and forced them apart. I've heard of that spliting a whole > transmission in two; if so it could definitely crack your starter housing. > > Tedd > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From rv7 at b4.ca Sun Feb 3 22:41:57 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] DeltaHawk Diesel References: <000601c1ad34$24e55b00$ade94118@cg.shawcable.net> Message-ID: <3C5E2D35.7090107@b4.ca> Does Deltahawk have a website? At $18KUS it's a just a dream in my mind, but what the heck, no point in discounting anything when i'm at least four years from needing it... 8-) Rob Prior RV-7 Empennage Harv Wregget wrote: >Thanks for the quick reply Tedd. DeltaHawk plans to sell their 200 hp >engine for $18,000 US, about 2/3 the cost of the IO360A2. It sounds too >good to be true, but just in case their numbers prove correct, I have listed >myself with them for delivery for no money down. Now I better get to work >on a RV 8. > >Thanks again, > >Harv > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Tedd McHenry" >To: >Sent: Sunday, February 03, 2002 10:46 AM >Subject: Re: [Wing] Re: Jabiru Engines > > >>Harv: >> >>I haven't been following the DeltaHawk, specifically, all that closely. >> >But I > >>think diesel aircraft engines have a very strong future. There's a good >>article about some of the European diesel aircraft engines in the >> >November, > >>2001 issue of Flyer, a magazine from the UK. Reading between the lines, >> >it > >>appears that diesel aircraft engines are a done deal, so far as the >> >Europeans > >>are concerned. Because of the diesel's greater efficiency, and especially >>because of the fuel taxes in Europe, the cost savings with a diesel are >>enormous over there. >> >>However, the economics of diesels in North America is quite different. >>Europeans are prepared to pay more, up front, for a diesel engine, with >> >the > >>promise of significantly lower operating costs. The European diesel >>manufacturers aren't claiming that they can match the up-front price of a >>Lycoming. In North America, however, with a much lower cost of fuel, >> >customers > >>are more interested in up-front cost. This is particularly true in the >>homebuilt market. It appears that a lot of what drives the experimental >> >engine > >>movement in North America is the goal of lower up-front cost than a >> >Lycoming, > >>or perhaps better performance for the same cost. Consider the two most >> >popular > >>new engines for RVs, the Chevy V6 and the Mazda rotary. Neither engine >> >can > >>match a Lycoming's fuel efficiency. But either one can give you similar >>performance for less money or, in the case of the rotary, and with some >>engineering, better performance for about the same money. >> >>The goal of the NASA/GAP diesel engine program is somewhere between the >>European model and the V6/rotary model. They're aiming to keep the cost >> >down > >>through lower parts count (and government-subsidized development!), and >> >gain > >>the fuel efficiency advantages of a diesel for about the same up-front >> >cost as > >>a Lycoming, maybe a bit lower. I don't know where the DeltaHawk fits into >> >that > >>picture. To be successful, I think they need to sell for not just less >> >than > >>list price for a Lycoming, but also less than the discounted price that >> >most > >>Lycoming customers get these days, through Van's, Lancair, Sequoia, or >>whomever. That will be very hard to do, since the development cost of a >>Lycoming is already amortized long ago. Also, the heavily discounted >> >price > >>that Van's and other companies get make it clear that Textron-Lycoming is >>milking the piston engine market, and will drop their list prices >> >significantly > >>if they ever get much competition. To me that makes what DeltaHawk is >> >trying > >>to do very difficult. >> >>I believe the best hope for a viable alternative to Lycomings in the >> >150-200 Hp > >>range, which the homebuilt market badly needs, lies in two areas. The >> >first is > >>engines built overseas, in places with lower cost of production. The >> >Jabiru is > >>the best example I know of. With the Australian dollar hovering around 50 >>cents U.S., and using modern design and manufacturing techniques, Jabiru >> >can > >>produce a superior engine for less cost. They're already doing this in >> >the > >>80-120 HP range. The new 180 HP engine will probably prove to be superior >> >to a > >>Lycoming also, and at a lower price, although it's obviously too early to >> >claim > >>that yet. The second place we'll get alternatives to Lycoming is in >> >home-grown > >>development of auto conversions, and the leading candidate there is the >> >Mazda > >>rotary. Rotary homebuilders are beginning to organize themselves along >> >the > >>lines of the open-source software movement. This is a very efficient way >> >to do > >>engineering development, and I have very high hope for this movement. In >> >much > >>the same way that open source software provides a viable alternative to >> >the > >>near-monopoly of Microsoft (including, for example, the software that runs >> >this > >>email group), a homebuilder-based movement of rotary engine deveopment >> >could > >>provide a viable alternative to the near-monopoly of Lycoming in the >> >150-200 HP > >>engine market. >> >>As for the technical merit of the DeltaHawk engine, I can't really comment >>because I haven't looked at it that closely. >> >>Tedd >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Wing mailing list >>Wing@vansairforce.org >>http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing >> > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > -- --------- Rob Prior rv7 "at" b4.ca ----------------------------- Stop dreaming... Start flying From rtaylor at telus.net Mon Feb 4 13:27:04 2002 From: rtaylor at telus.net (Roy Taylor) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] New E-mail address Message-ID: <3C5EFCA7.E846AA5C@telus.net> Hi everyone: We now have a new email address effective February 1, 2002. New address: rtaylor@telus.net Thank you....Pauline & Roy -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://retrix.com/pipermail/wing/attachments/20020204/9128dda4/attachment-0001.htm From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Feb 5 06:23:49 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] RVs in Western Canada Message-ID: Thanks to some research by Wing member Linda Todd, of Abbotsford, we have some interesting statistics on RV ownership in B.C., Alberta, and Saskatchewan. In those provinces, two-thirds of the owners of registered RVs are Wing members. There are 56 registered RVs and, based on the number under construction, that number will nearly double in the next few years! And that only counts RVs under construction by Wing members. There are many more under construction by non-members. BC AB SK total registered RVs 38 10 8 56 Wing members with registered RV 28 4 5 37 Wing members with RV under const. 31 14 5 50 (This table is best displayed in a monospace font, e.g. Courier.) --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From bdavies at pacificcoast.net Tue Feb 5 11:19:22 2002 From: bdavies at pacificcoast.net (Beatrice Davies) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] RVs in Western Canada References: Message-ID: <000701c1ae7a$04c2c140$de224d18@gv.shawcable.net> Could we please be taken off the mail list again. We will rejoin at a future date. Thank you ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 6:23 AM Subject: [Wing] RVs in Western Canada > Thanks to some research by Wing member Linda Todd, of Abbotsford, we have some > interesting statistics on RV ownership in B.C., Alberta, and Saskatchewan. > > In those provinces, two-thirds of the owners of registered RVs are Wing > members. There are 56 registered RVs and, based on the number under > construction, that number will nearly double in the next few years! And that > only counts RVs under construction by Wing members. There are many more under > construction by non-members. > > > > BC AB SK total > > registered RVs 38 10 8 56 > > Wing members with registered RV 28 4 5 37 > > Wing members with RV under const. 31 14 5 50 > > > > > (This table is best displayed in a monospace font, e.g. Courier.) > > --- > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Wed Feb 6 13:57:11 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building Message-ID: I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If nothing else, it should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want to do it. However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it comfortably. I'm working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, etc.). So I could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet spacing from wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, to me. (In case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on whether the space I have is adequate? Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From reagleston at ibigroup.com Wed Feb 6 14:39:29 2002 From: reagleston at ibigroup.com (Ron Eagleston) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tedd, I built my 8A wings simultaneously in my 11' wide garage that had 2' shelves along one wall. I had about 3' clear between jigs. I think it was worth doing it that way. Ron Rebel flying 8A finishing > From: Tedd McHenry > Reply-To: wing@vansairforce.org > Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 13:57:11 -0800 (PST) > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building > > > I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea > appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If nothing else, it > should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite > significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want to do it. > > However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it comfortably. I'm > working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". > Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the > moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, etc.). So I > could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet spacing from > wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, to me. (In > case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a > straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) > > Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on whether the > space > I have is adequate? > > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From ve7fp at jetstream.net Wed Feb 6 15:47:03 2002 From: ve7fp at jetstream.net (Ken Hoshowski) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: Message-ID: <006701c1af69$4daa0720$b2bb17cf@kenhoshowski> Tedd, If I were building another RV I would definately build both wings at the same time. It is much easier to fabricate a left and a right gusset at the same time, or numerous other parts. I seem to recall making two right hand instead of one left and one right because there were 6 months between wings and I didn't pay attention to the fact that I was now building the opposite wing to the drawings. Couple of suggestions, when drilling rib attach brackets take a look under the spar to see what you are drilling into and when predrilling holes in brackets don't assume all the holes in all the brackets will be in the same place. Those of you who have prepunched parts need not worry about this but those of us who didn't learned the hard way. Ken RV6 C-FKEH Salmon Arm B.C. First flight Sept.8,1993 Tedd McHenry said: > I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. From arrvee at vcn.bc.ca Wed Feb 6 16:23:39 2002 From: arrvee at vcn.bc.ca (arrvee) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building Message-ID: <001001c1af6d$c2b7b540$974066cf@arrvee> Ted When I built mine I had 3 feet between centers but the bottom surfaces of the wing faced each other Larry -----Original Message----- From: Tedd McHenry To: Western Canada Wing List Date: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 2:32 PM Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building >I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea >appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If nothing else, it >should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite >significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want to do it. > >However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it comfortably. I'm >working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". >Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the >moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, etc.). So I >could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet spacing from >wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, to me. (In >case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a >straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) > >Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on whether the space >I have is adequate? > > >Tedd McHenry >Van's Air Force >Western Canada Wing >tedd@vansairforce.org >www.vansairforce.org > >_______________________________________________ >Wing mailing list >Wing@vansairforce.org >http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From haywire at telus.net Wed Feb 6 18:23:19 2002 From: haywire at telus.net (Haywire) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ted; I built my RV-9 wings simultaneously and it worked out great. Even on the pre-punch kits, there are many parts to fabricate and it is easier to make both at the same time. When you do it this way you will do all the pro-seal together (hey, it's really not that bad of stuff), rivet skins on together so you only need a helper once, and then build the jig and do both ailerons & flaps together. I must admit though that I am blessed with a large shop, so space wasn't an issue. S. Todd Bartrim 13B rotary powered RV-9 (finish kit) C-FSTB (reserved) > -----Original Message----- > From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On > Behalf Of Tedd McHenry > Sent: February 6, 2002 1:57 PM > To: Western Canada Wing List > Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building > > > I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea > appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If > nothing else, it > should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite > significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want > to do it. > > However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it > comfortably. I'm > working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". > Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the > moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, > etc.). So I > could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet > spacing from > wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, > to me. (In > case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a > straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) > > Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on > whether the space > I have is adequate? > > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tgannon at stoneboat.com Tue Feb 5 20:09:09 2002 From: tgannon at stoneboat.com (Terence Gannon) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Tedd -- you saw my shop while you were still living in Alberta, so you know how small a space I'm working in...but for the rest of the list, I have a one-and-a-half car garage, a sport-ute, and winters that dictate parking it inside at least six months of the year. So I'm working in a space not much wider than six feet, so both wings at once is not an option. However, for anybody else that might be in the same situation, I can offer a hint -- wherever possible, do the sub-assemblies for both wings at the same time. So in my case, I'm just about done with the left wing, but the right wing is pretty well along, as well. Both ailerons are built, both flaps are pretty much done, both sets of ribs are primed, every bracket and other part that is mirrored on both wings is done, and of course, all the jigs only have to be built once. So I'm assuming the second wing will go very quickly...it's not quite in quick build, but it will go one heckuva lot faster than the first. In an event, if lack of space is your concern, it shouldn't be. Where there is a will, there is a way. Terry in Calgary RV-6 S/N 24414 "Wings" From guyb at shaw.ca Wed Feb 6 22:09:42 2002 From: guyb at shaw.ca (Guy Bourgeois) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: Message-ID: <000401c1af9e$088cbfe0$ba9d4018@guys> Hi Terry, Where in Calgary are you? I recently started building RV7. I live in Somerset and have been building in a shop near Heritage Point. Would like to talk to other RV builders in Calgary. Cheers, Guy From acornyn at telusplanet.net Wed Feb 6 22:31:50 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: Message-ID: <004001c1afa1$21184a40$601bb8a1@USER> Definitely build both at the same time iven if you have to move the kitchen table. If you screw up both wings equally it will fly straight. Mine does. Al RV-6 Flying Installing UPS MX20 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tedd McHenry" To: "Western Canada Wing List" Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 2:57 PM Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building > I'm looking for opinions on building both wings simultaneously. The idea > appeals to me, as it seems to be a bit more efficient. If nothing else, it > should save some redundant head-scratching time, which can be quite > significant! If I had unlimited space, I'm pretty sure I'd want to do it. > > However, I feel that I may not have enough space to do it comfortably. I'm > working in a two-room workshop. The wing assembly room is 10' by 13'6". > Nothing else needs to go in that room except the wing and jig, but at the > moment it houses a few other things (tool cabinets, plans table, etc.). So I > could build side-by-side wing jigs with approximately 3.5 feet spacing from > wall to wing CL, and between wing CLs. This seems a bit tight, to me. (In > case you're wondering, the door is in the center of one end wall, nearly a > straight shot out to the other room once the wings are done.) > > Does anyone who's tried simultaneous wings have an opinion on whether the space > I have is adequate? > > > Tedd McHenry > Van's Air Force > Western Canada Wing > tedd@vansairforce.org > www.vansairforce.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From gmouck at attcanada.ca Wed Feb 6 23:51:48 2002 From: gmouck at attcanada.ca (gmouck) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: <000401c1af9e$088cbfe0$ba9d4018@guys> Message-ID: <002b01c1afac$4cae1f80$4449b5cf@hppav> Guy, I am working on the wiring of an RV9 and only live about 5 miles from Heritage Pointe. If you want to pop over and have a look, give me a call. My number is 938-2498. Gary ----- Original Message ----- From: "Guy Bourgeois" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building > Hi Terry, > Where in Calgary are you? I recently started building RV7. I live in > Somerset and have been building in a shop near Heritage Point. Would like to > talk to other RV builders in Calgary. > Cheers, > Guy > > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Feb 7 06:33:30 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building In-Reply-To: <002b01c1afac$4cae1f80$4449b5cf@hppav> Message-ID: Thanks very much to everyone who replied to my question about simultaneous wing building. It seems almost unanimous that it's the way to go. As a bonus, it looks like the thread of messages will result in a few builders in Calgary getting to know each other! What more could I ask for? --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From tedd at vansairforce.org Thu Feb 7 07:09:43 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Langley RV Fly-in 2002 Message-ID: The Langley Aero Club and Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing are holding a fly-in for RVs on Saturday, June 8, 2002 at Langley airport (CYNJ). This is shaping up to be a really good event, with some fantastic features already planned, and probably more to come. Keep an eye on the Fly-in web page for details, http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ Perhaps you're already the proud owner of a flying RV. Lucky you! Then you'll surely want to fly in for a chance to win the People's Choice award for the best RV, and to show off your beautiful airplane. There will be plenty of space on the field for parking. You can camp on the field, or stay in one of the hotels near the airport. We'll be posting information about accommodation on the Wing web site over the next few weeks. Currently building an RV? Then you're probably thinking a lot about those first flights. We're going to have Mike Seager, Van's authorized RV transition training instructor, available for transition instruction in his RV-6. For more information, or to schedule instruction, contact Mike Seager between 7:00am and 9:00am Pacific Time at (503) 429-5103. Mike can also be reached via e-mail at rv6cfi@vernonia.com. You'll also enjoy the seminar on engines, by Bart Lalonde of Aero Sport Power, and RV safety, by Eustace Bowhay. We are very fortunate to have these two highly respected aviation professionals come to our fly in. Are you an RV wannabe? Seriously thinking about building one, but unsure about what's involved, the cost, the time commitment? Worried that you don't have the skills? Then you'll be interested in talking to the representative from Van's Aircraft who will be there, and attending the seminar I'll be giving, "Introduction to RV Building." The seminar will cover those basic questions, and others, and will be a place where you can ask whatever's on your mind about the building process, and maybe even try a little practise rivetting. If you just like to look at RVs, this is probably going to be your best chance inside Canada this year. There are 38 RVs registered in B.C., and we hope to have a sizeable proportion of them at Langley. We've been contacted by groups as far away as Saskatchewan and southern California who've expressed an interest in flying in with their RVs. So we expect a great turn out, and some really interesting RVs to look at. Naturally, we're encouraging anyone who wants to fly in, regardless of what type of airplane they have. If you plan to attend, and especially if you plan to fly in, please take the time to write me at tedd@vansairforce.org or, if you prefer, sign the Guest Book on the Fly-in web page. http://www.vansairforce.org/CYNJ/guestbook/lac_sign.html That will help us plan facilities such as food, washrooms, and customs for U.S. visitors. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From guyb at shaw.ca Thu Feb 7 09:54:55 2002 From: guyb at shaw.ca (Guy Bourgeois) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Simultaneous Wing Building References: <000401c1af9e$088cbfe0$ba9d4018@guys> <002b01c1afac$4cae1f80$4449b5cf@hppav> Message-ID: <001401c1b000$8d211a50$709d4018@guys> Hi Gary, Sure would like to go over and see what you are up to with your RV9. I will call you or feel free to call me at anytime. My numbers: Res: 640-6232 Cell: 560-3872 Cheers, Guy From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Feb 15 07:03:23 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV-6A Plans For Sale Message-ID: A couple of days ago someone posted an ad for RV-6A plans. You can see the ad at http://www.vansairforce.org/classifieds --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From m.speer at shaw.ca Mon Feb 18 22:05:27 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Getting going? Message-ID: <3C71EB27.859685B1@shaw.ca> What's the procedure for having the work inspected as we build our RV's. How do you go about getting the aircraft registered? Thanks Mike Speer From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Feb 19 06:39:36 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Getting going? In-Reply-To: <3C71EB27.859685B1@shaw.ca> Message-ID: > What's the procedure for having the work inspected as we build our > RV's. How do you go about getting the aircraft registered? > > Thanks Mike Speer Mike: You'll get the official answers from MD-RA (Minister's Delegates - Recreational Aircraft), the new organization that is now responsible for inspections and CofAs for amateur-built aircraft. http://www.md-ra.com/ Basically, you begin by filing a letter of intent to build an amateur-built aircraft. You file the letter with MD-RA. I believe you can do it through their web site, although the service is down at the moment. Later, at the appropriate time, you request inspections through them. In practice, it's probably smart to get to know your inspector well before any inspections. They're an invaluable source of information. Tedd McHenry From 2w at telus.net Tue Feb 19 10:35:29 2002 From: 2w at telus.net (Bill Robson) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Getting going? References: Message-ID: <000401c1b974$350bdf80$3243e8d8@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello Tedd Thats good advise to get to know the inspector before you really need him. But how do you do that when they keep their names and phone numbers a secret ? Bill Robson From m.speer at shaw.ca Fri Feb 22 17:57:32 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 Message-ID: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with sliding canopy, electric flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a clue, at this point anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal online and have started to acquire some elementary tools. I know that I want to build this aircraft however at this point I do not have the necessary skill to do the job. If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking bar I would like to get some hands on training. Thanks ...Mike Speer From tedd at vansairforce.org Fri Feb 22 18:10:40 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 In-Reply-To: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> Message-ID: > If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > Thanks ...Mike Speer Mike: I don't have any bucking coming up in the immediate future, but you're welcome to stop by, see my project, and talk turkey about building. I'm in Cloverdale, not far away from Richmond. Tedd McHenry From rv7 at b4.ca Fri Feb 22 18:29:30 2002 From: rv7 at b4.ca (Rob Prior) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: Message-ID: <3C76FE8A.4030200@b4.ca> I'm a half-step ahead of Tedd on when i'll be riveting next, but a full step or two behind him in terms of overall progress... Seeing as i'm only on the tail, and he's getting ready for the wings. But i'm in the same boat you are, in that i've never done any riveting. There's a lot of work to do to get to this point, though, so don't be afraid to start. You'll probably be setting up your shop for the first month before you get anywhere close to wanting to rivet anything, and then you'll be doing preparatory work for the next month before you're ready to bang a rivet. -RB4 RV-7 Empennage Tedd McHenry wrote: >>If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking >>bar I would like to get some hands on training. >> >I don't have any bucking coming up in the immediate future, but you're welcome >to stop by, see my project, and talk turkey about building. I'm in Cloverdale, >not far away from Richmond. > From fvalarm at rapidnet.net Fri Feb 22 22:31:28 2002 From: fvalarm at rapidnet.net (B. Tomm) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <00c901c1bc33$baeaf980$bb8d35d1@cheryls> Mike, I'm building a 7A in Abbotsford, no help with bucking is needed at this point but you can visit if you want to come this far. Bevan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Speer" To: Sent: February 22, 2002 5:57 PM Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with sliding canopy, electric > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a clue, at this point > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal online and have > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know that I want to build > this aircraft however at this point I do not have the necessary skill to > do the job. > If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From acwrench at yahoo.ca Sat Feb 23 09:19:43 2002 From: acwrench at yahoo.ca (pat morency) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 In-Reply-To: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <20020223171943.66944.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Mike, I bought my tail feathers about 90% completed and the wing kit in the box with alot of tools I'd only heard about. Today I have the left wing in the jig the leading is drilled deburred and dimpled along with all the top and bottom skins. I've made a few mistakes along the way and had to go back and either correct or compensate for them. The best piece of advice I could give you is "Ask Questions" when you get stumped and don't be afraid to start. You might want to get a few pieces of sheet metal, drill some holes, deburr, and practice slammin' rivets. This whole project seems to be about READIN' and RIVETIN'. Best of Luck! Pat in Calgary --- Mike Speer wrote: > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with > sliding canopy, electric > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a > clue, at this point > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal > online and have > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know > that I want to build > this aircraft however at this point I do not have > the necessary skill to > do the job. > If there is anyone out there who needs to have > someone hold the bucking > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing ______________________________________________________________________ Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca From cliffada at telusplanet.net Sat Feb 23 21:45:06 2002 From: cliffada at telusplanet.net (Cliff Adams) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] re: Starting an RV7(A) Message-ID: <3C787DE2.30750190@telusplanet.net> I too had some doubts about riveting stuff but thanks to Barry Tunzlemann (working in Edmonton for a while) I got some fine tips and "how to's..." and a little dual on a rivet gun. The best I can offer right now is 1. Use a 3X gun at fairly low pressure... 40 to 80 PSI and tease the trigger gently to get the rivet started...make sure the bucking bar is held square to the work 2. It is essential the work is held firmly in place...nothing is worse than having the rivet set jump all over your nice new aluminum making smiles in the surface 3. Barry taught me to recognize and drill out bad rivets...practice how to do this as you will have a bad rivet or two for sure. A piece of masking tape on the end of the cupped rivet set (especially the 1/8" rivets) helps to protect the factory head nicely. 4. While a rhythm does develop when rivetting, I've found that the first few rivets always require some thought and care when driving. 5. The knowledge curve seems steep at times but you will become proficient...good building and best of luck Cliff Adams RV7A Emp (half done & 90% to go on the tail feathers) From m.speer at shaw.ca Sun Feb 24 00:22:15 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] re: starting a RV Message-ID: <3C78A2B7.A9AC7AB@shaw.ca> Thanks to all locally who have answered the call for help and made generous offers to let me come and see their projects. It's surprising how many aircraft are under construction and the wealth of information available. Thanks again ...Mike From acornyn at telusplanet.net Sun Feb 24 21:17:48 2002 From: acornyn at telusplanet.net (Al Cornyn) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:34 2005 Subject: [Wing] re: Starting an RV7(A) References: <3C787DE2.30750190@telusplanet.net> Message-ID: <002001c1bdbb$c4d1eab0$891cb8a1@USER> Don't set the gun too light because you will work harden the rivets then the don't squish worth a s___. But it is all worth it. Al RV6 flying with apollo mx20 just installed Can't get lost now.------- Original Message ----- From: "Cliff Adams" To: Sent: Saturday, February 23, 2002 10:45 PM Subject: [Wing] re: Starting an RV7(A) > I too had some doubts about riveting stuff but thanks to Barry > Tunzlemann (working in Edmonton for a while) I got some fine tips and > "how to's..." and a little dual on a rivet gun. The best I can offer > right now is > 1. Use a 3X gun at fairly low pressure... 40 to 80 PSI and tease the > trigger gently to get the rivet started...make sure the bucking bar is > held square to the work > 2. It is essential the work is held firmly in place...nothing is worse > than having the rivet set jump all over your nice new aluminum making > smiles in the surface > 3. Barry taught me to recognize and drill out bad rivets...practice how > to do this as you will have a bad rivet or two for sure. A piece of > masking tape on the end of the cupped rivet set (especially the 1/8" > rivets) helps to protect the factory head nicely. > 4. While a rhythm does develop when rivetting, I've found that the first > few rivets always require some thought and care when driving. > 5. The knowledge curve seems steep at times but you will become > proficient...good building and best of luck > > Cliff Adams RV7A Emp (half done & 90% to go on the tail feathers) > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > From rtaylor at telus.net Sun Feb 24 23:03:43 2002 From: rtaylor at telus.net (Roy Taylor) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] re: starting a RV References: <3C78A2B7.A9AC7AB@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <3C79E1CF.68C2E300@telus.net> Hi Mike, I live in Richmond and in the final stages of building an RV6A. Give us a call, my home phone is 604 274 0258; Office 604 276 0550 Roy Taylor From patman at itdoesntsuck.com Mon Feb 25 10:34:15 2002 From: patman at itdoesntsuck.com (Pat Dayman) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.1.20020225133148.009e9aa0@pop3.norton.antivirus> While doing the annual inspection recently I realized that there was no air filter on my RV-4 (obviously I did not build this one) I got looking and can add one with a modification to the lower cowl. Not a big job, but any input anyone has as to running with/without the filter would be greatly appreciated. Pat Dayman CF-JOJ From fo320 at sympatico.ca Mon Feb 25 14:43:52 2002 From: fo320 at sympatico.ca (RV-4) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.1.20020225133148.009e9aa0@pop3.norton.antivirus> Message-ID: Hello Pat I've been flying my RV-4 (0-320 E2D) off a grass strip for the last 2 years without an air filter and so far I've had no problems.The only thing I did was to put a small metal screen in the air intake to catch the big pieces but nothing like a filter air box. I also have an Ellison Throttle boby injector installed which might make a difference. Hope this helps Bruno Dionne RV-4 C-GDBH Bellefeuille,Quebec ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------- -----Original Message----- From: wing-admin@vansairforce.org [mailto:wing-admin@vansairforce.org]On Behalf Of Pat Dayman Sent: February 25, 2002 1:34 PM To: wing@vansairforce.org Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter While doing the annual inspection recently I realized that there was no air filter on my RV-4 (obviously I did not build this one) I got looking and can add one with a modification to the lower cowl. Not a big job, but any input anyone has as to running with/without the filter would be greatly appreciated. Pat Dayman CF-JOJ _______________________________________________ Wing mailing list Wing@vansairforce.org http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From mdeg at shaw.ca Mon Feb 25 15:28:46 2002 From: mdeg at shaw.ca (Marc Degirolamo) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter References: <5.1.0.14.1.20020225133148.009e9aa0@pop3.norton.antivirus> Message-ID: <004001c1be54$2c6177c0$db874718@ss.shawcable.net> I assume that you have the foam and screen on your -4.....While this is OK putting on the B&N filter which Van sells would be a definite improvement......the advantage is that you get filtered air all the time.....Engines cost way too much to overhaul and dirt etc. going through the carb (applying carb heat during runup) will shorten the life of your cylinders......In short I would not run without a filter... Marc DeGirolamo C-FRVE getting ready to do annual..... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pat Dayman" To: Sent: Monday, February 25, 2002 12:34 PM Subject: [Wing] O-320-E2D air filter > While doing the annual inspection recently I realized that there was no air > filter on my RV-4 (obviously I did not build this one) I got looking and > can add one with a modification to the lower cowl. Not a big job, but any > input anyone has as to running with/without the filter would be greatly > appreciated. > > Pat Dayman > CF-JOJ > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From acwrench at yahoo.ca Mon Feb 25 19:12:17 2002 From: acwrench at yahoo.ca (pat morency) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] backriveting Message-ID: <20020226031217.39716.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> To All, Has anyone out there backriveted the top skins of the wing and if so how? Read an article from Eric Henson and he refers to a Frank Justices instructions. Thanks Pat in Calgary ______________________________________________________________________ Find, Connect, Date! http://personals.yahoo.ca From dgmurray at telusplanet.net Tue Feb 26 06:18:57 2002 From: dgmurray at telusplanet.net (Douglas G. Murray) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] backriveting References: <20020226031217.39716.qmail@web11903.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <005901c1bed0$8803a5e0$531bb8a1@dgmurray> Pat - I am now flying an RV-6 that I back riveted the wing top skins on. It looks real good and I feel was easier to build. I used the 15" backriveting set from Avery and the 3# bucking bar that looks a bit like the head of an overgrown nail. The 15" set reaches through the wing past the ribs from the bottom side and a helper holds the bucking bar against the top of the skin as the riveter sets the rivet. The helper removes the Clecos and inserts the rivets so the riveter can continue seting the rivets. I hope this helps - but if it isn't enough , please feel welcome to call me and talk about it. Doug Murray - RV-6 C-GRPA Mountain View, Alberta (about 2 hours south of Calgary) 403-653-2087 ----- Original Message ----- From: pat morency > To All, > Has anyone out there backriveted the top skins of the > wing and if so how? Read an article from Eric Henson > and he refers to a Frank Justices instructions. > Thanks > Pat in Calgary From tedd at vansairforce.org Tue Feb 26 09:47:30 2002 From: tedd at vansairforce.org (Tedd McHenry) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] RV Transition Training at Langley Fly-in Message-ID: One of the featured events at the Langley RV Fly-in (June 8) will be RV transition training. The training will be conducted by Mike Seager, the Vans-authorized transition pilot. I've taken Mike Seager's training, and I found it very worthwhile. We're now booking sessions with Mike for the weekend of the Fly-in. Mike will be available for three days, from Thursday, June 6 to Saturday, June 8, with about six flights per day. We expect this to be very popular, so I encourage you to book early while there are still slots left. Linda Todd is organizing the bookings, and can give you pricing information. Contact me off-list (i.e. at tedd@vansairforce.org) for Linda's phone number. --- Tedd McHenry Van's Air Force Western Canada Wing tedd@vansairforce.org www.vansairforce.org From m.speer at shaw.ca Tue Feb 26 23:43:46 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <3C76F70C.7F2C7DFA@shaw.ca> <00c901c1bc33$baeaf980$bb8d35d1@cheryls> Message-ID: <3C7C8E32.A7269D67@shaw.ca> Hi Bevan, Thanks very much for the kind offer, it is quite frankly amazing how many aircraft are under construction in the Vancouver area. I will definitely give you a call and drop bye when it 's convenient. ..Mike "B. Tomm" wrote: > Mike, I'm building a 7A in Abbotsford, no help with bucking is needed at > this point but you can visit if you want to come this far. > > Bevan > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mike Speer" > To: > Sent: February 22, 2002 5:57 PM > Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 > > > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with sliding canopy, electric > > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a clue, at this point > > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal online and have > > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know that I want to build > > this aircraft however at this point I do not have the necessary skill to > > do the job. > > If there is anyone out there who needs to have someone hold the bucking > > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From m.speer at shaw.ca Tue Feb 26 23:53:35 2002 From: m.speer at shaw.ca (Mike Speer) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <20020223171943.66944.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3C7C907F.29385509@shaw.ca> Pat Thanks for the words of encouragement. Dropped in on a -6a project this week there are at least two that I know about in my neighborhood, amazing . I've stopped trying to convince myself and have made the order for the RV-7. I am a lot more comfortable since I joined the "wing" and have met a few builders, once I get a few thousand rivets under my belt it won't seem like such a big deal. I pass through YYC on a regular basis with my job so I will give you a call. Thanks.. Mike pat morency wrote: > Mike, > I bought my tail feathers about 90% completed and the > wing kit in the box with alot of tools I'd only heard > about. Today I have the left wing in the jig the > leading is drilled deburred and dimpled along with all > the top and bottom skins. I've made a few mistakes > along the way and had to go back and either correct or > compensate for them. The best piece of advice I could > give you is "Ask Questions" when you get stumped and > don't be afraid to start. You might want to get a few > pieces of sheet metal, drill some holes, deburr, and > practice slammin' rivets. This whole project seems to > be about READIN' and RIVETIN'. Best of Luck! > Pat in Calgary > --- Mike Speer wrote: > > I am beginning my project to build an RV-7 with > > sliding canopy, electric > > flaps, elevator trim, and basic night VFR. > > I live in Richmond BC and quite frankly don't have a > > clue, at this point > > anyway, what I am doing. Have learned a great deal > > online and have > > started to acquire some elementary tools. I know > > that I want to build > > this aircraft however at this point I do not have > > the necessary skill to > > do the job. > > If there is anyone out there who needs to have > > someone hold the bucking > > bar I would like to get some hands on training. > > > > Thanks ...Mike Speer > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wing mailing list > > Wing@vansairforce.org > > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Web-hosting solutions for home and business! http://website.yahoo.ca > _______________________________________________ > Wing mailing list > Wing@vansairforce.org > http://vansairforce.org/mailman/listinfo/wing From jjewell at telus.net Wed Feb 27 00:51:53 2002 From: jjewell at telus.net (Jim Jewell) Date: Sun Jan 16 11:26:35 2005 Subject: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 References: <20020223171943.66944.qmail@web11907.mail.yahoo.com> <3C7C907F.29385509@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <001501c1bf6c$00cd1ce0$4d76e8d8@bc.hsia.telus.net> Hello Mike, If you are going to be coming to Kelowna some time send me a warning so I can have the beverage of your choice on hand. My 6A is much done with a lot left to do yet. There are quite a few RVs in the Okanagan. If time permits some visiting, their owners like to show off their work almost as much as I do mine. It's a long drive so feel welcome to stay over a bit. Starting out on this adventure was so great!, The whole experience has been stupendous! I am hooked, I can't imagine not doing it again. I hope it' turns out the same for you. Jim in Kelowna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Speer" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 11:53 PM Subject: Re: [Wing] Starting a RV-7 > Pat > > Thanks for the words of encouragement. Dropped in on a -6a project this > week there are at least two that I know about in my neighborhood, amazing > . I've stopped trying to convince myself and have made the order for the > RV-7. I am a lot more comfortable since I joined the "wing" and have met a > few builders, once I get a few thousand rivets under my belt it won't seem > like such a big deal. > > I pass through YYC on a regular basis with my job so I will give you a > call. > > Thanks.. Mike > > pat morency wrote: > > > Mike, > > I bought my tail feathers about 90% completed and the > > wing kit in the box with alot of tools I'd only heard > > about. Today I have the left